PC or Mac (or Linux?)

[Todd Patten]

OK, since no one will discuss politics here, lets go with the next most controversial subject out there: Do you use a PC or a Mac for your photo and graphics editing?

As a veteran software engineer who works largely in PC environments, I have always owned PC's. As I started to get into web design and graphical design I found myself curious about the Mac hype. I checked out the G5 and learned that it's OS was derived from Unix (the most power OS I have ever worked with). I was blown away by it's interface and it's graphics. I didn't purchase one as I had recently bought a Dell laptop for my main computing.

Now comes my digital photo passion with the recent purchase of the D70. Throw in my desire to buy myself a nice digital video camera and I'm beginning to think that a Mac G5 may be in order. Or maybe a Powerbook. That would make 4 PC's, one Linux machine and one Mac in my office area

Do you use a Mac or a PC? If you use a PC, have you thought about switching? If you have switched, would you go back to a PC? Can a PC do graphics just as well as a Mac? I mean, I use my laptop configured to use dual monitors (with a 17" LCD attached) and it seems fine, but everyone raves about the Mac. Does it really make that much of a difference?

[Hodgy]

I work in PC. EVerything from photo to video. I have worked on Mac, and just can't justify it. IT's not like the end product will be better if produced by mac, they will both be the same. The mac might get you there faster and smoother. For the $$ and the limitations on some software, I'm a PC man, and very stubborn. I havent found anything that can be done on a Mac, that I can't do on a PC>

[MaxPower]

Do I use a Mac or PC?

First I have over 12 years of experience using the Mac and PC platforms and most recently I have been getting into Unix. I manage a network of PC's and Macs.

For the most part a PC will do the job that a Mac does. The end result will be comparable, if not the same. That being said, in my honest opinion, I feel that a Mac is by far the superior product here. Allow me to explain.

Stability
The Mac OS is a Unix based OS. You add that with the ease of use Apple is famous for and you have one serious OS.

Viruses
I don't have to worry about the Virus of the week with my Mac. On the other hand, I am constantly patching and updating all of my Windows machines to protect them from the latest viruses. There are roughly over 500,000 viruses for the PC, and around 50 for the Mac (OS 9), one for OS X.

Graphics
I hate to use this term, but traditionally Macs have been known as a Graphics machine. And since we are in a Photography Forum this fits. Everyone I know in the Digital Imaging Industry use Macs because they are the best machine for the job.

They Just Work
Microsoft is a software manufacturer. Dell, HP etc make the hardware. We hope everything works together. Seamlessly. Microsoft has its own problems worrying about security let alone coding their software for every PC maker out there. Apple on the other hand make both the software and the hardware. They are meant to work together. And they do very well.

Price
At first glance Macs appear more expensive than it's PC counterparts. Now build a PC that is comparable to the Mac. Add a true 64 bit OS (not possible) Add 5 USB ports. Add two FireWire (IEEE 1394) 800 ports and two FireWire 400 ports. Add a DVD burner. The list goes on. Now compare prices. The Mac is considerably cheaper than a PC.

Software
Lastly, there is an old argument that there is more software titles available for the PC. True. However, the market is saturated with PC titles. Do we really need 50 word processors? Take a look at a computer store that sells both Mac and PC software. On the PC side 90% of the software titles are Games. On the Mac side 90% of the software titles are productivity. Which platform is a more serious work machine?

Any way long story short, if you haven't guessed I am a Mac Nut. But this hasn't come without research. I'm not trying to convert anyone, I'm just trying to make people aware that there are other options other than PC's. But if you feel that the PC is a better platform and it suits your needs, hey all the power to you. All I know is that when you're trying to get your digital camera running by installing and tweaking drivers, I'll already be up and running on my Mac.

[schrackman]

I've worked on PC for years, and just 2 years ago I moved over to a Mac running OS9. It took a while to get used to the environment but I found the Mac to be more functional and powerful than a PC where it pertained to graphics. I now have a new eMac that runs Panther OSX using a 1.25 Ghz processor and 768 MB of ram (budget constrained me, otherwise it would have been a G5 with dual processor!) but this little mac outperforms any pc we have at the office (including the new Dells). In fact, our in-house graphic artist is the only employee not using a PC–she uses a PowerMac...now why is that? It's because all the reasons mentioned in the previous post. Personally, I will never go back to a pc at home...I am stuck on Mac for good.

Ray

[megan]

I use a PC at work because I have no choice. The graphics we do have to be accessed by the bankers and analysts, all of whom are unfortunately PC based.

At home I use a Mac - I'm still po' with a G4, but I love me my Mac. The PC feels like a calculator on steroids, and I hate *the blue screen of death*. Did I say I love my Mac? It's brilliant. Macs rock.



Megan

[MaxPower]

I use a PC at work because I have no choice. The graphics we do have to be accessed by the bankers and analysts, all of whom are unfortunately PC based.

At home I use a Mac - I'm still po' with a G4, but I love me my Mac. The PC feels like a calculator on steroids, and I hate *the blue screen of death*. Did I say I love my Mac? It's brilliant. Macs rock.



Megan

Megan, Why does it matter that you have no choice to use a PC for the BAnkers and Analysts?

What format are the Graphics in? Or is it a networking concern?

[megan]

"Back in the day" they [bankers/analysts] used to require slides and hardcopies, transparencies for overheads, and large print-outs for flip-books. These days, everything is hooked up to a computer, and done with a screenshow using - gah - Powerpoint [or Flash, but predominantly Powerpoint.] Not only do the bankers/analysts need to open what we do on their screens, they also send us information in varying (and surprising) form. Some software like Excel and Word are cross-platform. However, I *think* when Windows 97 came out, Powerpoint [which used to be cross-platform and would open on a PC and Mac with no problems], Powerpoint was no longer programmed to be opened on either/or *seamlessly*. I could be wrong, I'm getting old! I can open up other stuff - i.e. Photoshop and all - between the PC and Mac with no problem. But I like to go home and relax in my comfy chair, and the Mac is like a comfy chair. It's easier *for me* to use, more intuitive, I've used one for years, and it works for me! But I can see why others would use a PC.

Megan

[opus]

I have nothing new to add.

If you add a Mac to your mix, you'll have all bases covered. I'm sure you'll like your Mac as long as you use it regularly. And when you plug your video camera in and it works the first time, you can come back and answer your own question.

Just get into a good habit of organizing and archiving your work on a regular basis. The Mac is so easy to use, you might just fill it up.

[darkman]

Quite frankly, I don't think it matters one way or another. At my last employer I used macs and HP workstation. Now I'm using a PC and a Sun running solaris. At home I'm using a PC. All systems have their quirks; no doubt. I didn't feel more productive on any one more than another.

I know our IT guys like unix. It's great for data bases for sure. However, it's somewhat of a myth that unix is more stable. Let me explain. I've found that stability, per say, is more dependant on the application than the OS. There are applications that lock up my PC and there are apps that lock up my sun. You can argue that in the extreme cases I have to shutdown my PC. Conversely, on the extreme with the sun I can go to another machine and kill the process then go back to my machine. To some this is meaningful. For me it's easier to reach in back and turn the sun off then on. Moreover, the same was true when I ran a mac. Some apps just aren't that friendly.

The advantage, as I see it, goes to the PC. This is because it's more widely supported by both hardware and software manufacturers.

[megan]

I work for a big sprawling global investment bank. Our network is also global... so i think it's easier for all involved to keep the platform as uniform as possible. One department does use Macs, but they're on a whole different server.

Megan

[Sean Dempsey]

the video game industry is one of the biggest industires in the world concerning computers.

That is why PC's are popular, and will continue to be so. Any aregument that Macs are even CLOSE to pc's as far as gaming is concerned is a total joke and should be deleted by moderators ;)

[MaxPower]

Powerpoint is still cross platform and still comes bundled with MS office. As well the files open with ease on the Mac and vice versa.

It's an old myth that PC and Mac files are incompatible. A .jpg is a .jpg, a .doc is a .doc and so on. Powerpoint is no exception.

Networking PCs and Macs is also seamless. My network consists of 10 PC's and two Macs. One Mac of which is my file server. All the machines are networked to them and the PC's can't tell that they are connected to a Mac.

[MaxPower]

the video game industry is one of the biggest industires in the world concerning computers.

That is why PC's are popular, and will continue to be so. Any aregument that Macs are even CLOSE to pc's as far as gaming is concerned is a total joke and should be deleted by moderators ;)

This is true. but as I mentioned in my previous post, 90% of the software for PC's are games, 90% of the software for Macs are for Productivity.

In general Mac users are not interested in gaming. I do have a few games for my Mac, but I play them when I'm bored. I'm not that big of a gamer. I'd rather be playing in Photoshop or editing video.

However, if I wanted to get into gaming, then yes, I would get a tricked out PC.

[Sean Dempsey]

It's a little known fact that the robots in "I Robot" were powered by Intel positronic chips, sold to US Robots and Mechanical Men.

[opus]

Powerpoint is still cross platform and still comes bundled with MS office. As well the files open with ease on the Mac and vice versa.

It's an old myth that PC and Mac files are incompatible. A .jpg is a .jpg, a .doc is a .doc and so on. Powerpoint is no exception.

It's very true that I can open a Powerpoint created on a PC without troubles. EXCEPT certain fonts. I tried converting a PC Powerpoint file to an EPS, and one font wouldn't convert, it just disappeared. I opened another Powerpoint file and was about to convert it, when I noticed that the artist had typed the title of his play in lower case letters. This seemed odd to me (I'm familiar with his style and this was odd), so I realized that he must have used some funky all-caps font that I didn't have.


Fonts are the last major problem between the two systems, as far as I'm concerned, unless things have changed drastically in the past two years.

[Todd Patten]

I find my PC/Laptop is very stable with XP Pro on it. However, the virus and privacy issues on a PC have started to grind on me. I have a router, firewall, virus scanner and multiple adware programs -- but still feel unsafe at times (is it not ironic that I feel unsafe with a trojan on my machine OK, off color but that;'s me!). I've switched to Mozilla Firefox for my primary browser (love it) and Thunderbird for my email (like it) to remedy some issues.

From a techy standpoint I love the Linux machine but if you think installing srivers on a PC is time consuming, wait until you try to get a wireless network card runnign on RedHat 9 Linux! For strongly unix/linux techies it may be no problem but I don't have an hour to find the answers online and apply them to my Linux box.

I know my next machine will be a Mac or powerbook. More than anything I like to try new things. I hate being out of the loop on anything! Mostly, I love the Mac "launchbar"

[MaxPower]

It's very true that I can open a Powerpoint created on a PC without troubles. EXCEPT certain fonts. I tried converting a PC Powerpoint file to an EPS, and one font wouldn't convert, it just disappeared. I opened another Powerpoint file and was about to convert it, when I noticed that the artist had typed the title of his play in lower case letters. This seemed odd to me (I'm familiar with his style and this was odd), so I realized that he must have used some funky all-caps font that I didn't have.


Fonts are the last major problem between the two systems, as far as I'm concerned, unless things have changed drastically in the past two years.

What is more than likely happening is the Mac is substituting the font because it doesn't have the font that your colleague used. It's very common on the Mac. On a PC however, if you don't have the font, it would most likely crash ;)

That's the nice thing about .pdf's. No need for font substitution.

[opus]

What is more than likely happening is the Mac is substituting the font because it doesn't have the font that your colleague used. It's very common on the Mac. On a PC however, if you don't have the font, it would most likely crash ;)

That's the nice thing about .pdf's. No need for font substitution.

Max, it's true that I didn't have the second font. My point is, there are often funky PC fonts used by "the little guys" (anyone who would create an ad for a magazine in Powerpoint is a "little guy" to me), and I know to not even bother looking for its Mac font counterpoint.

But the first one puzzled me, because I was able to make a Tiff and a PDF of the file. I could even open it in Illustrator and it looked fine. But when I went to make an EPS of it, the font dropped out.

[MaxPower]

Max, it's true that I didn't have the second font. My point is, there are often funky PC fonts used by "the little guys" (anyone who would create an ad for a magazine in Powerpoint is a "little guy" to me), and I know to not even bother looking for its Mac font counterpoint.

But the first one puzzled me, because I was able to make a Tiff and a PDF of the file. I could even open it in Illustrator and it looked fine. But when I went to make an EPS of it, the font dropped out.

That is a puzzling situation. Quite honestly I don't know what's happening. But it does sound like an Illustrator thing rather than an OS issue.

BTW, what OS do you use? If you are using OS X DO NOT remove any fonts in /Library/Fonts

Since OS X is Unix, you need to know the OS not function without certain Fonts. So to play it safe, leave the fonts where they are. I've just seen that happen too many times.

[opus]

That is a puzzling situation. Quite honestly I don't know what's happening. But it does sound like an Illustrator thing rather than an OS issue.

BTW, what OS do you use? If you are using OS X DO NOT remove any fonts in /Library/Fonts

Since OS X is Unix, you need to know the OS not function without certain Fonts. So to play it safe, leave the fonts where they are. I've just seen that happen too many times.

max, I am using OS X, v 10.3.4.

I do not move my fonts. That reminds me of a funny "Mac vs. PC" story. I used to work in a prepress shop, all Mac and Scitex (Unix). My boss only worked on Macs, virtually since the day they came out.

So we get our first PC in the shop, to handle the files the inexperienced people sent. The PC was in the shop a few months, when my boss went on a cleaning spree. She didn't like how all the files on the PC were "hanging" outside of folders, so she went in and cleaned them all up, organizing everything into folders.

Lo and behold, the PC wouldn't start up after that day.

Many hours and many dollars later, she learned her lesson.

[MaxPower]

max, I am using OS X, v 10.3.4.

I do not move my fonts. That reminds me of a funny "Mac vs. PC" story. I used to work in a prepress shop, all Mac and Scitex (Unix). My boss only worked on Macs, virtually since the day they came out.

So we get our first PC in the shop, to handle the files the inexperienced people sent. The PC was in the shop a few months, when my boss went on a cleaning spree. She didn't like how all the files on the PC were "hanging" outside of folders, so she went in and cleaned them all up, organizing everything into folders.

Lo and behold, the PC wouldn't start up after that day.

Many hours and many dollars later, she learned her lesson.

Sadly I learned that lesson myself when I started using computers.

I was very green fresh out of college with little computer experience. I was playing around in our accounting package when I decided to change what G/L accounts were left and right. Needless to say, my Balance Sheet wouldn't balance. It took someone all afternoon to undo what I accomplished in 5 minutes.

The moral of this story: If it ain't broke. Don't fix it.

[Sean Dempsey]

This thread needs to be renamed "Windows, Mac, or Linux", btw.

Lots of PC's don't run Microsoft. I don't think it's fair to have "PC" mean windows machine, especially to the "PC" manufacturers, whos products work well in windows machines, linux, macs, freebsd, os2warp, or whatever else.

and, I bet I can find more than a handful of people who will tell you their Intel/AMD based Linux machine is more stable and reliable than a Mac box...

[mjm]

correct me if im wrong but doesnt the mac run on a bsd kernel not a unix kernel. bsd is not unix.

oh, i am all for linux once they get photoshop ported over. suse 9.1 professional is excellent.

I bet I can find more than a handful of people who will tell you their Intel/AMD based Linux machine is more stable and reliable than a Mac box

if you can count servers i get 18-20 votes for that...

[mjm]

I find my PC/Laptop is very stable with XP Pro on it. However, the virus and privacy issues on a PC have started to grind on me. I have a router, firewall, virus scanner and multiple adware programs -- but still feel unsafe at times (is it not ironic that I feel unsafe with a trojan on my machine OK, off color but that;'s me!). I've switched to Mozilla Firefox for my primary browser (love it) and Thunderbird for my email (like it) to remedy some issues.

if you keep your system patched and behind a hardware firewall you don't have to worry about that stuff (as much). i am running XP Pro, Firefox & Thunderbird with no local AV, Firewall or adware crap... my system runs excellent & clean. If you know how to set it up properly you don't have as many worries about that stuff.

[Mig]

Yes, OS X's Darwin is a Mach/BSD combo.

I'm quite pleased with SuSE 9.1 myself - I'm currently using just the personal version at home since I don't really need anything from the pro version and free is good. WinXP is still hanging around just for Photoshop and a few other apps, but I'm getting comfortable with GIMP.