Controversial Subject

[CarbonTerry]

I'm relatively new to this forum, but it surprises me that only 10% (or less) of the viewers will submit a critique. The worst thing that can happen is for you to learn something new! You might get your feelings hurt a "tad" but if you are going to be a photographer, you had better get used to that.
C'mon folks, step up and speak your piece.

[Dzerzhinski46]

I'm relatively new to this forum, but it surprises me that only 10% (or less) of the viewers will submit a critique. The worst thing that can happen is for you to learn something new! You might get your feelings hurt a "tad" but if you are going to be a photographer, you had better get used to that.
C'mon folks, step up and speak your piece.

Dear Terry,

I suppose you could call it "sniping". The inability to show yourself or your work. And when you finally do, you get hit bad because everyone takes a pot shot at you because you tore their picture to shreds . It works both ways. The photographer doesn't want to show his work for fear of getting a savage "critique", and everyone wants to voice their "expert" opinion without being examined closer. Not that some of the people who post here aren't expert in one way or another (I could cite any number of people). You could blame any number of people for the problem, but unless people feel comfortable posting on the critique forum, then we have a serious problem. You're right, critique is meant to be constructive, improving the photographer and their work. Just let it be constructive, not polemic. Most of the critique I have seen has been pretty mild, and constructive for the most part. Let's keep it that way.

Dzerzhinski

[CarbonTerry]

Very Funny....as I viewed this thread again...11 views....1 response.....LOL
WOOHOOO post # 100 for me and I've only been here 2 weeks or so. Warm weather will see me on the baseball fields and very little on the 'Net.

[AA20D]

Well, in my case, I have virtually no serious shots in digital. I have used a point and shoot digital for family stuff since 2001. However, I just made the switch to digital SLR in early December and have been way to busy to venture outdoors with it yet. So everything I have with digital SLR is family "pot shots". Not something I wish to post. And I do not have a film scanner to scan my past work. Conclusion: I'm basically starting from scratch again.

[gahspidy]

Very Funny....as I viewed this thread again...11 views....1 response.....LOL
WOOHOOO post # 100 for me and I've only been here 2 weeks or so. Warm weather will see me on the baseball fields and very little on the 'Net.

Terry,
This issue has been brought up a few times before in a variety of different fashions. A few posters in the past had complained when they saw their thread had a high number of views and only a few or no comments.
I think the reason for this "phenomenon" is that on this site ( and maybe a moderater can correct me if I'm wrong) visitors can view threads, but cannot comment unless they become members and sign on with a screen name. But their views will still count. So you may have quite a few visitors viewing a thread ( especially if the title of the thread has a catchy name to stir some curiosity), but only a smaller percentage of those views may be from members able to comment.
Personally, I am still using dial-up connection due to lack of availabilty at this time of the high speed access I would prefer, and so viewing and commenting on threads for me takes a substantial amount of time, and I'm sure I'm not the only one. However, I make a point of it to comment on many more threads than do I post. I usually first look for threads that have gone for some time without any comments, and then I go to the threads of those who have given me their valuable time, and then I try to hit the newcomers.
There is also something that I think is important here, and have found this forum to be very good with, and that is posting ettiquette. I believe it is important to be respectful to all , regardless of whether or not one finds anothers work good or not. For the most part, this forum is full of mature, talented and creative persons with a great genorosity for giving thoughts, tips, opinions, critique and praise. And since you have joined this forum, I have enjoyed reading your comments and critiques as they are obviously coming from someone with much experience and good ideas. But on the other hand, I was somewhat dissappointed on my last thread ( Faces with no soul?) when you obviously looked, and made a comment, but the comment had nothing to do with the image but was rather asking another member his location in his country. I took it that you did not care for the images , which is fine, but thought it a bit rude. I would not have even thought to bring it up , but for you having raised the issue of commenting on threads. I think we all have room for improvement, be it snapping shots or posting critiques.
I for one am glad to have you on this forum and look forward to more give and take on this great board.

[Peter_AUS]

Critiques come and go in cycles, it depends on what interests people and there is often a following of one persons work or another. I don't post a lot of images myself, they are mainly of my family anyway, and don't post many critiques because I don't think I have that much of a creative eye for the sutleties that is required with photos. My main input to these forums, is help where I can give it, reporting spam that I see, as often I am one of the first to see it, being in Australia, so time zones come into play.

Also there are a few here that have been burned along the way as well, with their efforts to help and instruct as well.

Just a few reasons.

[Words]

i hve to hold my hands up and admit that i am a "lurker" but - its not because im afraid of critique (ive been a pro for over 15 ears, so i can take the negatives ;) ) but its for 2 reasons, 1 i have just started my own site ;) and 2 because there are so many sites i wouldnt have time to post on all of them.

i just like places like this to view other peoples work. im sure many people are afraid to post there work but a community needs to pull together and give advice not criticize for the sake of it (not saying this for does just that it happens everywhere)

[mdmc]

good thread C.T. Was just getting ready to post when the moon presented itself. loaded fuji 1600 in maxxum 7 and shot a roll. haveta post later!

[BamaFru]

Critiquing others work is very important, sometimes more important than having your own shots shredded or praised. In this forum, the purpose is to see how others view your work and offer suggestions on how to improve it. Alas, as always, it moves so fast and some of us really try to catch as many in the time you can, there will be some that just slide off the page without notice.

I just want to say...ALWAYS feel free to be totally honest on any of my posts/critiques, I try to do the same...even if I do ramble and am not always right! I tend to learn more when I do comment...even if it is just my opinion. I can try to use my own advice and others to get out there and avoid common mistakes, be more aware of lighting, watch for distractions, blah blah.

[JK_Photo]

This seems like a pretty active forum to me. I'm quite impressed with the activity here. Sure it would be nice if hundreds of people would post/critique, but we still wouldn't have time to get to all of them.
It's all relative
Some people just don't have the time. It is very time consuming. Some of us have the luxury of being able to spend a lot of time posting and some don't. Some can't be bothered and some won't.
In general I'd say everybody here is polite and constructive with their criticism. And if you can't take it - even politely - you shouldn't stick around. I'm not speaking to anyone specific, just in general.

I agree with Ghaspidy on a point he made; If you want to chat off topic, start a new thread or do it privately.
Well, that's my 2 cents. Back to posting/commenting!
Cheers

[readingr]

Terry and all,

I joined this group to learn and the people who do contribute advice are normally curtious and offer valuable advice.

I try and critique photos to say what I like and dislike even though I am not as technically proficient as many of you on this list. Terry - how many years as a professional - 20+ from memory. This list benefits from that level of experience and I believe that my photography is constantly improving from the comments and advice recieved.

Look at the quality of advice you have given on the Cinderella picture I posted recently. I knew there was something wrong and it was the first time I had ever tried to take a still life photo using lighting. This all came about because someone added a comment in a critique that we should all try new things which improves not only the new area but also the work that you normally take by opening your mind to different ways of doing things. Its because of this I tried to take Cinderella.

I have browsed other sites and still believe that the level of advice given on this site is much better than some of the others.

Please keep up the good work.

[ShotsbyScott]

Terry,
I've only been posting on this site since December and have had a blast.
I feel like the people on here, are pretty good folks.
Some of the other critiquing sites that I have visited are not as clean (nudity).
My 12 yr. old son frequently likes to look at some of the post, on this site, with me.
He & I read other peoples comments/critiques and look at the photo and give our on comments to each other. Then if we feel like we can add something that has not already been said, we will do so.
If we like the picture, we always do a quick reply with positive feedback.
I will admit, I have not commented on all pictures I have viewed. But, I do feel like I have critiqued my share based on the photography knowledge I have.

Good Post!
Thanks again to everyone that does take the time to give your opinion.
I feel I have already learned quite a bit in such little time.
To everyone else. If you feel like you don't have the words to critique a picture, at least acknowledge
that you have looked at it and say something like "I like this picture" or "this is not my cup of tea, but that is just me"

thanks,

Scott

[Chunk]

I think Gary's response is a pretty thourough analysis of how things work on the critique forum. What I usually do is look through the subjects and start viewing those that I have already had some interest in that have new responses. These would show up as another view. (No Steve, Not you )
Then I look at new posts. I don't generally respond to these if what I think has already been written or if it is in an area where I don't figure I'm very strong. On other threads I will sometimes revisit a time or two before critiquing rather than 'shoot off the cuff'.

On the whole, I think I post a lot more critiques than pictures and feel that I contribute sufficiently to the forum. I'm sure that the number of critiques I post is well below 10% of the number of viewings that I make and I am not at all ashamed of that.

For some of us, communications are more difficult than for others. To try give good critiques of a significant portion of the posts would be prohibitive for me. Since we are all volunteering our time I think it is good if we all just try to give back at least as much as we receive, but I don't think there needs to be some kind of accounting to anyone. I think it's fine too, that some folks are mostly just lurkers who are learning something from reading the posts. A lot of them start joining in after a time.

This forum is very valuable to me as I don't have another way of getting honest critiques. Family and friends are a good source of encouragment and praise but not a good source for critique or suggestions.

[mjs1973]

For myself, and I’m sure this goes for some others here as well, I just don’t feel that I have the expertise when it comes to giving good critiques. If I see a photo I really like, I try to comment on it, but if I see a photo that I don’t like, I often hold back for the simple reason that I don’t feel that I am a good enough photographer to tell someone else that their photo isn’t a good one. I love to post images and I love getting other opinions on my work, both good and bad. I look forward to hearing from everyone, what works, what doesn’t, what to try differently, etc. If you hate it, I want to hear that too, and why. I have held back some critiques because I don’t want to hurt someone’s feelings, but more often than not, it’s because I don’t feel that I have the expertise in the subject of photography to tell someone why their image doesn’t work for me. So, with that said, I am going to try to teach myself to be much more open with my critiques/opinions. I will try to comments on all of the photos in the critique section that I look at, good, bad or indifferent. I will do my part to give my opinions on everyone’s photos.

[readingr]

Michael,

I am not that good technically but still give my feedback because I know what I like. If I get the techy stuff wrong someone will correct me which means I learn.

So feel free to give me any type of feedback becuase I put my photos up to be critiqued in any way that people deem able

[gahspidy]

Just to add another thought here as I have seen now and often in the past about members being reluctant to offer comments because of their lack of expertise or experience.
I think it is just as important to me, and I'm sure for everyone else, to get feedback of any kind be it tecnical expertise or just " I like this" When someone with much experience or a pro gives valuable technical advice and perspective that is great, like icing on the cake. But when someone views an image and says " I think this is good" or " I'm not sure why, but I'm not feeling anything from this" I find those to be just as valuable to me because I can get an idea of whether or not I was successful at my attempt to produce an appealing image. If I were to post an image and most everyone thought it to be strong and found it appealing, and a couple of experts did not care for it, I would consider it a successful attempt with room for improvement.
The point is, any sort of honest feedback is a valuable measurement in sizing up an images success. So don't hold back, and no holds barred.

[CarbonTerry]

Great....some new folks posted...

[Overbeyond]

I agree with everything that has been said. I don't think anyone should feel they are unqualified to critique or feel not confident to post.
To those who lack confidence I would say there is no such thing as a bad photograph. Who is to say?
If you like it that is what is the most important. Everything else is just someone elses opinion. But on this forum I have found a very broadminded lot of members who will never put down your phohograph but are always willing to offer interesting ideas about postings.

[Photo-John]

Terry-
You're right. I wish more people should take the time to post critiques. However, since I've been here since the beginning, I can tell you that 10% or less of the site visitors make all of the contributions. The vast majority just look. And it's not just this site. That's pretty typical of all Internet communities. Some people are participants and some people aren't. That's just how it is. But it sure would be nice if more people took the time to share their thoughts. I also wish that there were less, "I like it." posts. I want to see people putting more critical thought and evaluation into their critiques. Good criticism works both ways - the photographer learns from the critique, and the critic learns from the process of the critique. Every time I take the time to post a detailed critique I learn something I can apply to my own photography. Learning to articulate the good and bad in a photograph helps us create better photos.

[JK_Photo]

Critiqueing makes you think and it helps reinforce what you already know as well as reinforcing new things you yourself are trying to apply in your own image-making.

[mtbbrian]

Sorry I haven't been around this past few weeks to chime in on this, but I have been away for work have had limited access.
I feel your frustration, but the best you can do is be active as you can in the forums, so people will get to know you and your photography.
Please don't give up on our community, there is a wealth of information here that you won't find anywhere else.
Brian

[bobbythebandit]

I have to agree with all the comments on the lack of critique, especially when i have posted a dodgy one and need help.The most valuable thing we have in this world is our time, and when some one gives me a few minutes of theirs i am very grateful, irrespective of whether i get good or bad critique.

[adina]

As in any other forum, the number of members greatly outnumbers the number of posters. Some people are more comfortable lurking, which is fine. I spent a good year or two lurking before I posted.

Even from the critique forum to the viewfinder to the help files, you'll see a huge difference in who posted. Some of the names you see commonly in this section don't ever show up on the viewfinder board.

As far as 7000 views and only 1 comment? I know that I'll look at something more than once, and if it's been commented on, I may look again, without making my own remarks. Different things inspire different people to type.

adina

[Outdoorsman]

Hmmm. I noticed this "phenomenon" right away when I joined last year, and it took me about 0.002 seconds to figure out what was going on. It's really not that big of a deal. If I was feeling whiny I might complain about it. Look, this is the internet and there are almost no rules. Courtesy is voluntary, as is respect, gratitude, assistance, intelligence, maturity, decency, and any other positive (or negative) character trait a person could have. I really don't care how many people viewed a thread versus how many posted, since it's only the replies I look at. Besides, we have better things to do than analyze the view/reply statistics of a lone thread in the vast sea that is the internet... don't we?
This really is a non-issue.

[getadrivingjob]

You guys are funny.

Curt

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