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  1. #26
    Senior Shooter Greg McCary's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    When does the poll end? My Nex7 still isn't here.
    I haven't handled every camera on the list either. But before I bought the a77 I really done a lot of homework. I read reviews, looked at DXO marks and dug up as much info as I could. As far as third party glass on the NEX7 if I could afford three Leica lenses I would own an M9.lol
    To be honest your better off using the glass designed for the job.
    I think I have used my Voigtlander 28 on my NEX5n once.
    I am like Barney Fife, I have a gun but Andy makes me keep the bullet in my pocket..

    Sony a99/a7R

  2. #27
    Captain of the Ship Photo-John's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Holy cow - who's manipulating the poll now? It's had about 100 votes so far this morning and the E-P3 has shot to the top.
    Photo-John

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  3. #28
    Captain of the Ship Photo-John's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg McCary View Post
    When does the poll end? My Nex7 still isn't here.
    No hurry, Greg. I'll probably let people continue to vote through the end of January. You don't have to handle or use a camera in 2011 for it to be a 2011 camera
    Photo-John

    Your reviews are the foundation of this site - Write A Review!

  4. #29
    Panarus biarmicus Moderator (Sports) SmartWombat's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    For me, it's the J1.
    Despite owning an XZ-1 and loving it.
    Despite probably upgrading to the E-P3 from my E-P1.
    Despite my most used camera for months being the iPhone 4.

    The fast continuous AF in that small package, and its use of mainstream (sorry Sony) SLR lenses with adapter is a great combination.
    Again they're pushing the competition as they did with high ISO low noise DSLR performance.

    If I was buying a compact system now, instead of when the E-P1 was launched, I would probably choose the J1 and not micro 4/3.

    But give it 6 months and we'll see Canon's response.
    PAul

    Scroll down to the Sports Forum and post your sports pictures !

  5. #30
    Captain of the Ship Photo-John's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Quote Originally Posted by SmartWombat View Post
    If I was buying a compact system now, instead of when the E-P1 was launched, I would probably choose the J1 and not micro 4/3.
    Wow - that's a surprise! You'd choose the Nikon over the NEX-7 with the mirrorless adapter? And why the J1 and not the V1? Personally, if I was going to jump into the Nikon 1 system, I'd much rather spend the extra dough to have the EVF.
    Photo-John

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  6. #31
    Senior Member Anbesol's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Wow... Just wow. Well, this poll just got destroyed. Now we just need a few more votes for the A77 and push that Nikon to the bottom lol.

    OK seriously though John, how about making a forum member poll, instead of an anybody-vote one? Might be more legit. You aren't going to keep this poll up are you? The validity has been shot.

    Whats with everybody's obsession with continuous AF? Its a unique style of technique for a specific type of photography, the type of photography that is certainly well into the minority. What good is it for portraits and landscapes? How many of the people that are buying this are actually doing so to use continuous AF? I bet the Continuous AF never even gets turned on on half of the Nikon 1's that are sold.

    I can count on one hand the number of times I've used continuous AF in the past year, most of the time I stick with manual focus/aperture as well.
    Last edited by Anbesol; 12-30-2011 at 04:05 PM.
    - Charlie

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  7. #32
    Captain of the Ship Photo-John's Avatar
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    iPhone 4s

    Quote Originally Posted by SmartWombat View Post
    Despite my most used camera for months being the iPhone 4.
    You know, I think you have pointed out the one camera that I maybe should have included in the poll and didn't - the iPhone 4s. With over 200 votes, though, I think it's too late to add it.
    Photo-John

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  8. #33
    Senior Member Anbesol's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    200 fake votes. Or, did some Olympus club of 100 something people find the poll?
    - Charlie

    Feel free to edit and repost my work as a part of your critique.

  9. #34
    Senior Shooter Greg McCary's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Well the NEX7 is here. I only got to play with it a few minutes. But I can tell you I won't put it over the a77. The a77 will focus in almost dark compared to anything I have ever owned even with a slower Tamron lens. The NEX 7 although may focus faster than the NEX5n. It can't touch the a77.
    I think it's the a77 hands down. I have seen images with the EP-3 and if it handles like the others in the EP series I would put it third. The NEX 7 should win second due to the built in finder and superior IQ. Plus the NEX 7 is a breeze to shoot in manual. A dial for aperture and one for shutter speed, just like it should be.
    If the N1 can beat the a77 in focus speed and FPS I would love to see it. The a77 sounds like a sewing machine. Plus the shutter is very quite. For a full time LV camera 12FPS is pretty impressive.
    Olympus got slammed for years for their small sensor and high noise levels. I can't really believe Nikon is putting out a smaller sensor with the noise levels at were it's at. I would like to see it compared to the XZ-1.
    John if you put up the Iphone4, my wife has one, you better put up the HTC Thunderbolt. My Thunderbolt takes better pictures than an Iphone4, just sayin'..


    NEX7 by Cosmonaut's, on Flickr
    I am like Barney Fife, I have a gun but Andy makes me keep the bullet in my pocket..

    Sony a99/a7R

  10. #35
    Captain of the Ship Photo-John's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Quote Originally Posted by Anbesol View Post
    Whats with everybody's obsession with continuous AF? Its a unique style of technique for a specific type of photography, the type of photography that is certainly well into the minority.
    Well, my obsession with it is that it makes a huge difference for the kind of photography that I do. And I know it's one of toughest bits of technology to improve. So when someone does a good job of it, I take notice.
    Photo-John

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  11. #36
    Senior Member Anbesol's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Thanks for posting that Greg. I don't think anyone was really trying to make the claim that the Nikon 1 does better continuous AF than a modern Pro APS body, but rather that it was faster than its CSC and consumer DSLR competition. I remember when they claimed "as fast as pro SLR", but that had an asterisk by its statement with an explanation of comparing it to "comparable, 3.5-5.6 lens" on those pro bodies. I'm sure a 2.8 SSM or high speed AF gear on the A77 would surpass the Nik 1's continuous ability. I recall John stating that the J1 couldn't keep up with his 7D, but was close.

    John - I understand that you have a use for it, and the kind of shooting you do continuous AF is useful. But most people rely primarily, or even singularly on single-shot AF for their technique. What I'm saying is that its benefit is for a niche audience, not the consensus. You are part of that niche, but most people are not. As such, people who are NOT part of that niche are doing themselves a disservice getting a camera that is inferior for everything except that niche.
    - Charlie

    Feel free to edit and repost my work as a part of your critique.

  12. #37
    Senior Shooter Greg McCary's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Charlie you are right. With most it's as much as looking cool as anything else. With that said most people never look at what I am using. To me it's getting the job done.
    I remember when Dennis Rodman played people would throw him tee shirts after the game with their logo on it. Knowing if he wore it after the game they would sell enough of them to make a small fortune.
    I am like Barney Fife, I have a gun but Andy makes me keep the bullet in my pocket..

    Sony a99/a7R

  13. #38
    Captain of the Ship Photo-John's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Quote Originally Posted by Anbesol View Post
    John - I understand that you have a use for it, and the kind of shooting you do continuous AF is useful. But most people rely primarily, or even singularly on single-shot AF for their technique. What I'm saying is that its benefit is for a niche audience, not the consensus. You are part of that niche, but most people are not. As such, people who are NOT part of that niche are doing themselves a disservice getting a camera that is inferior for everything except that niche.
    I totally agree with you. I would recommend the Nikon 1 to a lot of my skier and mountain biker friends for a backpack camera. But as I said in my review, if image quality is your top priority, then there are much better cameras to be had.
    Photo-John

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  14. #39
    Liz
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    Moderator Emeritus Liz's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Quote Originally Posted by Photo-John View Post
    Holy cow - who's manipulating the poll now? It's had about 100 votes so far this morning and the E-P3 has shot to the top.
    Maybe they all saw that National Geographic voted it Compact Camera of the Year!

    Liz

  15. #40
    Be serious Franglais's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Quote Originally Posted by Anbesol View Post
    Thanks for posting that Greg. I don't think anyone was really trying to make the claim that the Nikon 1 does better continuous AF than a modern Pro APS body, but rather that it was faster than its CSC and consumer DSLR competition. I remember when they claimed "as fast as pro SLR", but that had an asterisk by its statement with an explanation of comparing it to "comparable, 3.5-5.6 lens" on those pro bodies. I'm sure a 2.8 SSM or high speed AF gear on the A77 would surpass the Nik 1's continuous ability. I recall John stating that the J1 couldn't keep up with his 7D, but was close.

    John - I understand that you have a use for it, and the kind of shooting you do continuous AF is useful. But most people rely primarily, or even singularly on single-shot AF for their technique. What I'm saying is that its benefit is for a niche audience, not the consensus. You are part of that niche, but most people are not. As such, people who are NOT part of that niche are doing themselves a disservice getting a camera that is inferior for everything except that niche.
    How about video? All these cameras do video but if Grandma wants to follow the little one around the parlour and keep him in focus then there's nothing better than the Nikon 1 series on the list (I can't see her using a f2.8 SSM on an A77). Image quality is not so important for video.

    Nikon have designed these things to do good video - witness the power zoom lens option. Give the punters what they want.
    Charles

    Nikon D800, D7200, Sony RX100m3
    Not buying any more gear this year. I hope

  16. #41
    Senior Member Anbesol's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Franglais - is the benchmark how well grandma follows around the little 'uns? Nikons continuous AF is only good by mirrorless standards, my A700 from 2007 tracks subjects better than the Nikon does. The Nikons single-shot AF is also slower than Olympus E-P3/E-PM1/etc. Heck, its probably slower than the Sony and Panasonic as well, though I haven't directly compared the two as I have with the Nikon/Olympus.

    John - can you tell what sites are linking to your poll? Wonder why the massive influx.
    - Charlie

    Feel free to edit and repost my work as a part of your critique.

  17. #42
    Be serious Franglais's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Quote Originally Posted by Anbesol View Post
    Franglais - is the benchmark how well grandma follows around the little 'uns? ...
    Everyone has a different idea of what is important and that's what comes out in the vote.

    We know from our conversation with BravoGolfTango yesterday that video doesn't matter to you and me but it matters to him. It probably matters to anyone moving up to a hybrid from a modern point-and-shoot because they've been used to shooting videos as well as stills. They want something as good as or better than what they had. The bigger sensor brings better image quality but makes focussing trickier. Providing a good video experience for the users seems to have been a design priority for Nikon.

    I'm certainly not going to buy one of these things but I recognise good design.
    Charles

    Nikon D800, D7200, Sony RX100m3
    Not buying any more gear this year. I hope

  18. #43
    Senior Member Anbesol's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    and that's what comes out in the vote.
    It doesn't make focussing trickier. In fact, the E-P3/E-PM1 is still faster on single-shot AF than the Nikon is. I don't know about you, but in the occasional times I do use video, I use it with single-af.

    What comes out in the vote is most certainly not the individual thoughtfullness and priorities. I think its resoundingly obvious whats coming out in the polls is the undeserved clout that Nikon has and the fanboyism surrounding its base. Well, at least before the poll was destroyed.
    Last edited by Anbesol; 12-31-2011 at 06:53 PM. Reason: cleaned up.
    - Charlie

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  19. #44
    Senior Member Anbesol's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    John what the heck happened to the poll? Can you see which site linked to it?
    - Charlie

    Feel free to edit and repost my work as a part of your critique.

  20. #45
    Panarus biarmicus Moderator (Sports) SmartWombat's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Quote Originally Posted by Photo-John View Post
    Wow - that's a surprise! You'd choose the Nikon over the NEX-7 with the mirrorless adapter?
    Yes, because for me the main feature is the fast C-AF for sport.
    But if the NEX-7 has the same kind of image quality as other Sony cameras, I'd want that.

    And why the J1 and not the V1?
    I actually handled the J1
    EVF is useful, I agree, but at that price? It's a bit steep.
    Now if it had a plug-in artiuclated finder like the Olympus VF-2, that's different.

    Personally, if I was going to jump into the Nikon 1 system, I'd much rather spend the extra dough to have the EVF.
    I wouldn't put that much money into it yet. J1 is a good first step.
    It depends how committed they are to continuing the 1 series.
    As Sony apear committed to the NEX series.

    Jumping into micro 4/3 worked for me because there was more than one vendor.
    More choice of lenses, more choice of bodies, competition between manufacturers.
    Now with Nikon joining the market it's raised the stakes for all compact system cameras.
    PAul

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  21. #46
    Senior Member OldClicker's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Quote Originally Posted by SmartWombat View Post
    For me, it's the J1.
    Despite owning an XZ-1 and loving it.
    Despite probably upgrading to the E-P3 from my E-P1.
    Despite my most used camera for months being the iPhone 4.

    The fast continuous AF in that small package, and its use of mainstream (sorry Sony) SLR lenses with adapter is a great combination.
    I don't get this at all. Any of the mirrorless cameras can use the Nikon lenses with an adapter and, with the adapter, the 1 loses its AF advantage and becomes nothing. - TF
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  22. #47
    Senior Member armando_m's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Quote Originally Posted by OldClicker View Post
    I don't get this at all. Any of the mirrorless cameras can use the Nikon lenses with an adapter and, with the adapter, the 1 loses its AF advantage and becomes nothing. - TF
    That is correct with off brand adapters,
    AF works when using the FT1 Nikon adapter on the V1 ( I presume also on the J1)
    apparently it only supports the central focus spot
    and AF speed is still excellent

    VR also works when using the FT1 adapter

    I saw his reported on a nikongear forum

  23. #48
    Senior Member Anbesol's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Its all sort of irrelevant though when you consider that its using such a tiny segment of the image circle. Who wants to carry around 80% unused glass?
    - Charlie

    Feel free to edit and repost my work as a part of your critique.

  24. #49
    Senior Shooter Greg McCary's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Quote Originally Posted by Anbesol View Post
    Its all sort of irrelevant though when you consider that its using such a tiny segment of the image circle. Who wants to carry around 80% unused glass?
    Ditto, I really don't understand the need to shoot glass not intended for the camera. I really only do it for testing. Yes you can save money for example, Putting Leica glass on a mirrorless camera. But you throw away a good portion of an excellent lens when you do it.
    I am like Barney Fife, I have a gun but Andy makes me keep the bullet in my pocket..

    Sony a99/a7R

  25. #50
    Be serious Franglais's Avatar
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    Re: Vote - 2011 Camera Of The Year!

    Quote Originally Posted by Anbesol View Post
    Its all sort of irrelevant though when you consider that its using such a tiny segment of the image circle. Who wants to carry around 80% unused glass?
    I can imagine that a bird photographer would be delighted to have the equivalent of a 540mm f2 lens with the excellent follow-focus on a 10MPix camera in a small package (J1 + 200mm f2).

    Or how about the equivalent of a 65-190 f2.8 for racing cars? (24-70mm on a V1)

    It's the result that counts.
    Charles

    Nikon D800, D7200, Sony RX100m3
    Not buying any more gear this year. I hope

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