Intensity!

[Old Timer]

Some of the last basketball of the season. District finals and the intensity was evident in the faces of the players and the coaches.

[masdog]

Those are some great facial expressions that you have captured, OT. I see you have gotten most of your white balance issues taken care of.

[SmartWombat]

Oh yes, you've got it in #1 and #2
That coach is great in #4 it looks like he's trying to block the pass too !
I like the crowd watching the basket in #3, Initially I thoght it was shot too wide but the crowd makes it.

[Old Timer]

I hope some of the WB problems are solved however I've pretty much decided untill I get a noise program I'll just have to live with high noise that the D2H produces.

Thanks SW I know that basketball isn't your favorite thing to view, but I appreciated the comments and you saw athe same thing that I did in each of the shots.

[SmartWombat]

It's not that it's not my favourite - more that I get lots of it !!
It would be great to have more variety, and I think as spring approaches we'll get that.
There are times betwen baseball, football, and basketball, that I want some balance and a sport without balls !!

That's why I liked the ice dance photos so much, a totally different pace.
A sport of grace versus the force and violence of ice hockey.

[JBPhoto]

Old Timer - can you share what body and lens you used, and also your settings? These are great shots. I've been struggling through hockey and basketball season with a 20D and a Canon EF 75-300 f/4.0-5.6 IS, and experimenting with a Speedlite 580EX. Unfortunately only about a third are keepers (but nothing like this) and thats after they've been scrubbed with CS2. I am getting ready to pull the trigger on the "right" lens though, a Canon 70-200 f/2.8 IS.

Thanks,
Jeff

[JSPhoto]

JB,
The reason you are struggeling is two fold. 1: the 20D has slow AF when compared to pro bodies. 2nd - shutter lag
Add the two together and your really fighting it. You need to anticipate the action and shooter sooner.
The 70-200 will help, especially the low light issues, but you can never get over the hump with the slower AF and shutter lag.

I tend to forget about the AF speed and shutter lag but was reminded of it this morining when playing with my DRebel 300D, the old 1D and the new 1D MKII N. I was trying some things with each camera, lens and the 580EX. It's amazing how much faster the AF is on the two 1D bodies, especially the MKII N. The 300D though pokes along, sometimes searching for focus in lower light, even with the 70-200...but that shutter lag just kills me! I am so glad I don't need to use that camera anymore except when "playing".

JS

[Old Timer]

Old Timer - can you share what body and lens you used, and also your settings? These are great shots. I've been struggling through hockey and basketball season with a 20D and a Canon EF 70-300 f/4.0-5.6 IS, and experimenting with a Speedlite 580EX. Unfortunately only about a third are keepers (but nothing like this) and thats after they've been scrubbed with CS2. I am getting ready to pull the trigger on the "right" lens though, a Canon 70-200 f/2.8 IS.

Thanks,
Jeff

Jeff, I think that John gave you a very informed answer to your questions. I'm not real familiar with Cannon equipment but he certainly is. As for me I have struggled just like you in low light gyms and fieldhouses. these photo were shot at my local high school that has the worse light of any gym I shoot in. I gave up on available here and as you can see shoot with some flash. When I do this I never shot at full power or with any auto or program settings. I set the flash at 1/4 to 1/8 power and adjust the ISO, shutter speed and apperture to match. The manuel settings for most of these was SB800 at 1/4 power, ISO at 1000, shutter speed 200 and aperature at 3.5f. I am shooting wiht the Nikon D2H which also means like the 1D's that I don't have a lot of problems with shutter lag or slow auto focus (Although due to my own deficiences I do miss shots). All of these images were taken with the 80-200 f2.8 zoom. I hope this helps a little. Keep in mind that not two situations or location will were call for the same solution. You will have to do a lot of experimenting and come up wiht what works best under what conditions for you. After time you get to the piont that you can predict the out comes pretty will and cut way down on the trial and error. Good luck and let us see some of your images generally some of the guys here can help more once that get a look at what your results are.

[JBPhoto]

Old Timer and JS - Thanks for the feedback, I really appreciate it. Just this morning I ordered my 70-200 f/2.8. Eee-ha (but my wife is going to kill me). I am posting a few recent shots - these are the first shots I have posted to a forum, your critique would be appreciated. Blur with basketball seems to be inevitable for me, at least for now. I hope to have the new lens in time for the second round of the basketball tourney this Saturday. I haven't learned much about the setting on the 580EX yet. I was unaware of the power settings. Need to read the manual!

Both shots here were levels, contrast, color, gamma and luminance adjusted in CS2...

bball, shot with 75-300 f/4-5.6, 1/80 at f/5.0, ISO 800 with 508EX flash
hockey, shot with 75-300 f/4-5.6, 1/250 at f/6.3, ISO 800 with 508EX flash

[Old Timer]

Both shots here were levels, contrast, color, gamma and luminance adjusted in CS2...

bball, shot with 75-300 f/4-5.6, 1/80 at f/5.0, ISO 800 with 508EX flash
hockey, shot with 75-300 f/4-5.6, 1/250 at f/6.3, ISO 800 with 508EX flash[/QUOTE]


Even though tech data is good to help critique an image the ones you post are a little small to be able to tell a lot about sharpness. I think that is one of your main concerns. There are also two school of thought on the effect that blur has on sports pictures. Some feel that a certain amount of blur adds to the motion effect and enhances the photo from an artistic or creative point of view. Other want the action stopped dead in it tracks (most newspapers and other publication are in the catigory). I think it just depends on the photographer and what he wants and his use of the image. You basketball has some blur due to the 1/80th that it was shot at. However from the small image it looks like the face of the defender is sharp enough. However I might question if the image gives the viewer enough action to convey what a sports images would want to. I think this may be a direct result of the shutter lag that John meantioned earlier. The principal subject the dribbler has her back to the viewer. I'm not a hockey photographer so I will just say that your second image is well centered and composed and you got the puck in so to me it does the job but once again lacks that moment of action of contact that we like to see in good sports images. The only was get good at sports photography is doing a lot of it. It takes a lot of practice and work on timing to get those shots that you see in the newspapers and in Sports Illustrated. The new lens will be a big step in the right direction to help get you higher shutter speeds and faster focusing. Keep it up and post more pictures, you are off to a great start.

You might want to check out my Scramble post to see what the f2.8 lens can do without the flash help when you have a court that has a little better light. Scramble...

[JBPhoto]

BTW, how do I copy photos into the body of the message, as Old Timer has done?

DISREGARD - I answered my own question.

[JBPhoto]

OT - thanks for the feedback and the encouragement. Here is another hockey shot, which I particularly like. It's shot at with the 75-300 f/4-5.0 at 1/200, f/6.3 and ISO 1600, no flash this time. I tried to save it a bit larger this time for more detail...

[JSPhoto]

THey let you use flash for hockey? Thats a first, not around here, or anywhere I have ever lived, and played.

JS

[livin4lax09]

what the.... JBPhoto and JSphoto? oh god....

we can use flash for hockey around here...

[livin4lax09]

what the.... JBPhoto and JSphoto? oh god....

we can use flash for hockey around here...

[JBPhoto]

I know, sorry 'bout the closeness in name JS. I assure you it was unintentional. Happy to change it if its confusing anyone.

Re: flash with hockey, I was in a press box about 15 feet in the air shooting through an open window. It was the CT Bantam Division IV State Finals at the Milford Ice Pavilion, no issues. Tonight I was at the CT High School Division III Basketball State Semi-finals. There were three photographers all using flashes directly under the basket. THAT is something I never expected to see.

[JSPhoto]

JB, JS, no big deal to me, but then Liven is one of those half awake college kids, so he's easy to confuse ...... just kidding Liven!


Yeah, they do not allow flash here at all for hockey. Now basketball is another thing. All through the season we are allowed to use flash, but then tourney time comes and no more flash! The only way we are allowed to use flash is by using strobes mounted up high and off to the sides. Needless to ay the only ones using strobes are the AP & Indy Star photogs for the state finals.

JS