x-post.....vignetting with S50....need advice

[Liz]

Hi Everyone,

I posted this in digital cameras, but need some advice soon, so decided to post it here too. Here's the deal:

I purchased the S50 and returned a refurbished G2 due to the condition of the camera. I had been looking at the A80 and S50 as a 2nd camera to carry around. However, when I found a good deal on a refurbished G2, I bought that instead unfortunately.

I just shot the first pics with the S50 and have a question about vignetting. I don't recall reading any complaints about this with digital P&S cameras. However, eleven out of about 30 images had noticeable vignetting. These included shots taken inside with no flash, inside with flash, and outside on a nice blue sky day. The outside images were not as bad; the inside ones very noticeable.

Please advise if this is a problem that warrants exchanging, replacing or just returning the camera. I need to know asap.

I appreciate any help and thank you in advance so I can make a decision.

Liz

[Trevor Ash]

Post a photo Liz. Most all point and shoots have this problem including the G2. Post a photo and include the focal length and aperture settings.

[Liz]

Trevor - thanks.....

Please ignore composition/softness/overexposure - I was trying out the camera for the first time - this was in auto. I always do this first to see how the camera does in auto.

focal length 7.1
aperture 2.8 (with flash)
shutter 1/60

I'll post another without flash, but am having a slight problem with the pc at the moment, and it's very slow.

Liz

Post a photo Liz. Most all point and shoots have this problem including the G2. Post a photo and include the focal length and aperture settings.

[Liz]

first one - inside
focal length 7.1
ap 2.8
sh 1/4 sec

2nd one
focal length 7.1
ap 3.5
shutter 1/1000

thanks again.
Liz

Trevor - thanks.....

Please ignore composition/softness/overexposure - I was trying out the camera for the first time - this was in auto. I always do this first to see how the camera does in auto.

focal length 7.1
aperture 2.8 (with flash)
shutter 1/60

I'll post another without flash, but am having a slight problem with the pc at the moment, and it's very slow.

Liz

[Liz]

I got an error message and the 3rd one disappeared. Hopefully it will show up in only one place.....like here.

Liz

first one - inside
focal length 7.1
ap 2.8
sh 1/4 sec

2nd one
focal length 7.1
ap 3.5
shutter 1/1000

thanks again.
Liz

[Trevor Ash]

Okay. I'll have to admit that I wouldn't be especially happy with that amount of vignetting either. While I've seen that amount of vignetting before in supremely wide angle lenses (like the Sigma 14mm EX) I can't say that I'd call it "normal" for your camera.

Question: Did you perform ANY adjustment at all on those photos? I ask because any increase in contrast or saturation will amplify the amount of vignetting in a photo.

I've attached some photos I just took using my G3 pointed at the wall. First photo is widest angle at largest aperture. Next is widest angle at smallest aperture. Then it's longest angle at largest aperture. Finally it's longest angle at smallest aperture. I did no adjustments except chose "convert to grayscale". I highly recommend you take these photos of mine into your image editor and increase the contrast to see the vignetting even more.

I hope this helps. Personally, I wouldn't be too thrilled with your camera based on what I know and am seeing so far.

Trevor

[Liz]

Trevor,
I'll take your advice.....and thank you.

Contrast - the only one I edited except for size, was the last one (the one outside) with a very slight amount of contrast because downloaded here, it was difficult to see the vignetting, but it's there, although nothing like the other 2. The other 2 are straight out of the camera.

Question: is the vignetting problem (in your opinion) just this specific camera - I mean defective? Or should I check out other models......again? I probably should check other models, only because I don't want to keep returning cameras.

Thanks Trevor.

Liz

[natatbeach]

check out other models...I don't think I've had that type of problem even with the el cheapo 2.0 megapixel...

sorry to hear about it.

[Trevor Ash]

Trevor,
I'll take your advice.....and thank you.

Contrast - the only one I edited except for size, was the last one (the one outside) with a very slight amount of contrast because downloaded here, it was difficult to see the vignetting, but it's there, although nothing like the other 2. The other 2 are straight out of the camera.

Question: is the vignetting problem (in your opinion) just this specific camera - I mean defective? Or should I check out other models......again? I probably should check other models, only because I don't want to keep returning cameras.

Thanks Trevor.

Liz

I would suspect it's an inherent characteristic of that models optics and build. But I'm not really in the know here so if you like the camera enough you could always try one more of the same and see if it's different before you do anything too drastic.

Good luck.

[Michael Fanelli]

You know, those indoor shots remind me of every P&S, film or digital, that I have ever used! My old Olympus Stylus used to do that all the time, the S400 is pretty good. The flash just doesn't cover very well and leaves the outside darker.

The outside shot looks fine to me, perhaps my monitor isn't sensitive enough. You will get some distortion with these tiny lenses, but even that is something you have to specifically look for in that outdoor shot.

Here's a thought... Is it possible you have grown so used to the Rebel that a P&S just looks worse than it really is?

[Trevor Ash]

Liz,

Was the second photo you posted with flash? After reading Michaels comment I realized that ar least your first photo was shot with flash and he's absolutely correct about the coverage. If so, then try these shots again without flash and see if they're better.

Trevor

[Liz]

First regarding the photos posted here: The flash was only used on the first. I shot a few others without flash in the house and most have vignetting. I also have a couple with the flash, and no vignetting. Go figure.

Today I went to B&H (didn't buy the camera there, unfortunately for me) and spoke to the Canon representative (he's there full time now). He told me serious vignetting on some, but not all pics usually occurs when a lens has been dropped, or bumped. He mentioned something about the lens glass elements (I'm sorry, but I forgot the term) being moved or damaged. He said it frequently occurs with lenses that are damaged. He is knowledgeable, usually right on target and has helped me in the past.

I like this camera better than the A70 or A80, but may end up exchanging it for the A70 (cheaper). A70/A80 don't seem as bright as the S50, but when I took some shots with an A80 a while back, there was no vignetting. I still like the G2/G3. Beach camera around here has one of each (new), but charging too much IMO $450 & $499. If the G2 was less expensive I might consider it again.

Michael
You are absolutely right about not being satisfied with less quality anymore. I've concluded today that I am not going to get a mini Rebel in these Point & shoots, and I think I'm looking for that. I'm spoiled now, and I could drive myself crazy. A 2nd camera is not supposed to as good as a $1,500 piece of equipment (including lens). I may just settle for the A70 - $110 cheaper.

Thanks for any thoughts/comments/advice, whatever.

Liz

Liz,

Was the second photo you posted with flash? After reading Michaels comment I realized that ar least your first photo was shot with flash and he's absolutely correct about the coverage. If so, then try these shots again without flash and see if they're better.

Trevor

[Liz]

Best Buy didn't help. I usually get all my equipment from B&H. At Best Buy, returning something is next to impossible. The customer is ALWAYS wrong. I was there today to inquire about an exchange for another model (still haven't made a definite decision), but they want 15% restocking fee unless the camera is "their definition" of defective, and you have to prove it.

Even then, you have to get the exact same camera, can't even upgrade. I will NEVER buy anything there again. They told me that if I purchase their service contract for $60, I could exchange the camera for another model. That's about the only way you can do it, even if there is a defect. Sorry for venting, but thanks for "listening." I feel like I'm caught between a rock and a hard place here.

Liz

First regarding the photos posted here: The flash was only used on the first. I shot a few others without flash in the house and most have vignetting. I also have a couple with the flash, and no vignetting. Go figure.

Today I went to B&H (didn't buy the camera there, unfortunately for me) and spoke to the Canon representative (he's there full time now). He told me serious vignetting on some, but not all pics usually occurs when a lens has been dropped, or bumped. He mentioned something about the lens glass elements (I'm sorry, but I forgot the term) being moved or damaged. He said it frequently occurs with lenses that are damaged. He is knowledgeable, usually right on target and has helped me in the past.

I like this camera better than the A70 or A80, but may end up exchanging it for the A70 (cheaper). A70/A80 don't seem as bright as the S50, but when I took some shots with an A80 a while back, there was no vignetting. I still like the G2/G3. Beach camera around here has one of each (new), but charging too much IMO $450 & $499. If the G2 was less expensive I might consider it again.

Michael
You are absolutely right about not being satisfied with less quality anymore. I've concluded today that I am not going to get a mini Rebel in these Point & shoots, and I think I'm looking for that. I'm spoiled now, and I could drive myself crazy. A 2nd camera is not supposed to as good as a $1,500 piece of equipment (including lens). I may just settle for the A70 - $110 cheaper.

Thanks for any thoughts/comments/advice, whatever.

Liz

[p220sigmans]

Liz,
Did you talk with the store manager or just the person in the camera department. I had a similar situation with something I had bought there and once I talked with the store manager and showed him the problem was with the product itself and not me just "not being happy" with it, he got it taken care of. Might be something to try if you haven't already.

Terry

[Liz]

The first store I spoke with the store manager who was very rude. He had memorized the return policy and kept quoting it. It was as though I was transparent. I took it there first because it is closer.

Then I went back to the store where I purchased it. Everyone from the camera department was very nice and agreed I could return it. However, it was the supervisor/manager who was rude. At that store, they have a supervisor in each department (no storewide manager). This guy questioned everything, and gave me a really hard time.

I think I'm going to take it back, even if I have to pay the 15% restocking fee, and tell them that I refuse to deal with them, but will write to the powers that be. I just want to get out of any dealings with Best Buy.

Liz

Liz,
Did you talk with the store manager or just the person in the camera department. I had a similar situation with something I had bought there and once I talked with the store manager and showed him the problem was with the product itself and not me just "not being happy" with it, he got it taken care of. Might be something to try if you haven't already.

Terry

[p220sigmans]

I'm sorry to hear that you have had such problems. I would definately vent further up the chain even though you are not likely to have much success. I would also be sure to discuss the rudeness of the management. Eating the 15% may be the easiest thing to do to move on.

Terry

[Trevor Ash]

I'm bloody well hate Best Buy. The problem with going "up the chain" and speaking with "management" is that they always ARE management that you're speaking to. Or at least that's what they call themselves.

As far as going up the chain goes, you're bound to get nothing but a 1-800 number that leads you back to the manager in the store because the issue cannot be resolved over the telephone.

Now look what you did, you got my blood pressure going again!

[Trevor Ash]

Eating the 15% may be the easiest thing to do to move on.

I hate it when that's true!!! And it most probably is!! Except people like me are too stubborn to accept that fact and spend all kinds of energy to avoid the company getting more of my money.........why are we so stubborn?

[Liz]

Well, I said a prayer on the way to Best Buy that I would keep my composure when I returned the camera.

I was surprised, but the manager was nice, calm and apologized to me - and he actually listened. He said he would address what had happened and speak to the employee. He also explained that their employees don't work for commission except for the service agreements they "sell." He added that their 4 year service agreements include a brand new camera for some returns.

I was grateful that he was so nice, but I told him I didn't want another camera. I could tell he wanted me to "exchange" the camera, but I said no. He said he wouldn't charge me the restocking fee and credited my account. He also said if I wanted to purchase anything at anytime at Best Buy, to ask for him. However, I don't plan to go back, EVER. I'm just glad it's over. However, now it's back to Square one with the decision of which small camera to get.

Thanks for your help/support, etc.

Liz

I hate it when that's true!!! And it most probably is!! Except people like me are too stubborn to accept that fact and spend all kinds of energy to avoid the company getting more of my money.........why are we so stubborn?

[p220sigmans]

Liz,
I'm glad you got it resolved. Sometimes prayer does work or at least someone finally remembers that you are actually the customer and it is the store's best interest to keep customers happy when appropriate. I could under stand their stance if you had simply been trying to return a camera because you decided you didn't like it, but in this case, the camera had a demonstrable problem.

Terry