Need help getting sharp close ups

[sarahlou]

I am having trouble getting clear, sharp close ups - can anyone recommend the best settings? I'm just getting to grips with the settings!

[Medley]

two questions, before I answer:

What is the width of your display in inches? I only want the width, not the diagonal measurement. And just the display, not the whole monitor.

What display resolutions does your computer have available? All the possibilities please, not just the one you use most.

- Joe U.

[Grandpaw]

I must have read the question wrong, Jeff

[A.M.D.A.]

Hi,

Does your camera have a "Macro" mode? If it does, then you can try setting it.:thumbsup:

Also, if you are using a D-SLR, check on the lens to find out what the minimum focus distance is. Any closer will result in out-of-focus pictures.
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#1. I try to use a mini-tripod whenever possible. If I don't have it handy, I use the stabilizer in my lens. This helps prevent camera-shake, which can contribute to soft images.

#2. If you want the maximum depth of field, then set your lens’s aperture to a higher f-number. Mine goes to f/8.

For a sharp subject and a very blurred background, set a larger aperture, (smaller f-number).
I can post some pictures that show this effects.

#3. "Cont. AF" helps keep a subject in focus even if it or or the camera moves. The camera auto-focuses continually on its own. You just focus once at the beginning, and the camera keeps it focused.

This feature essentially maintains the subject sharp even if you move back a couple of steps or come up close. (It does drain the batteries faster).

[Frog]

Ok...looked at your profile and you do have an slr.
What lens are you using? Also what are your subjects?

[freygr]

I am having trouble getting clear, sharp close ups - can anyone recommend the best settings? I'm just getting to grips with the settings!

Most kit lenses will not focus for closeups (micro photography). On your lens it say's what the minim focus distance. With close up photographs you also have to deal with the Depth of Field (DOF) The DOF is the area which is in focus and the factors are the focal length of the lens and the F stop you are using. There are online DOF calculators. To increase the DOF you have to stop down (use higher F stops) or zoom wider, a shorter focal length. And to to have a very narrow DOF you use low F Stops. Longer lenses have less DOF than shorter lenses, which is way some PS have much better DOF in their close up images, as the actual lens focal length is some thing like 6 -18 mm, 35mm equivalent or 35-105mm for angle of view.

[Medley]

I must have read the question wrong, Jeff

Nope Jeff, I think that was MY mistake! For some reason, I thought he was asking about digital sharpening.

Note to self- more sleep.

- Joe U.

[Wild Wassa]

Can I suggest this technique?

Set the camera to the macro setting,

Set everything else to manual. This requires you to actually be a photographer (displaying photographic skills).

Set the lens focussing ring to the closest focussing distance. Do not change this during the shot. Do not try to focus the image with the lens focussing ring or switch the lens back to auto focus. Frog mentioned that you have an SLR ... you have no excuse then to not get it right.

Now, look through the viewfinder at your subject and without changing the focussing ring ... move the camera towards and then away from the subject ... do this several times.

Did you notice that the sharpness abruptly came and went?

That is how you actually focus any lense in macro mode or a dedicated macro lense. You move in, you move out, you do not try to focus a lens with the focussing ring or allow auto focus to get it wrong.

Move in ... move out ... you will see the image became sharper then loose sharpness abruptly ... when it looks spot-on, trip the shutter. This technique requires you to be fluid with your movements, think of it as a photographic ballet. This also requires a degree of anticipation but not that much. The more relaxed and fluid you are the better you become. You can photograph the reflections in a fly's eyes with this technique ... if you try to adjust the focussing ring to achieive the same, you will have Buckley's chance.

If your camera is tripod mounted ... you might find it easier to move your subject in or out.

If you are using a bellows for extreme macro, the bellows will have a sliding mount, a rail system which has a tripod mount. Spray the rails with some teflon lube, if the fine movements of the rail system are sticky or jerky.

There are many more techniques, but you will have to reply (and possibly post progress shots firstly), before I mention them, if you are still interested and are happy for my repliies.

Warren.

[Frog]

Interesting technique, Warren. I'll have to give that a try, though I don't do a lot of extreme closeups and it usually on a tripod with flowers or something.
What's the difference between moving the camera and turning the focus ring. Doesn't the focus ring do the same thing but only moving the lens closer or farther?

[dumpy]

Frog: Turning the focus ring, many times will alter the composition more than moving the camera (especially when in really close and using a macro lens). Also pre-focusing the lens to as close as possible, then moving in, really lets you get the largest possible image. I usually eyeball it this way and then set up my camera on a tripod and tweak using both the focus ring and moving the whole set up as needed until I've got it dialed in.

I've often thought that using the settings on a camera (other than full auto modes) should only be something that experienced photogs use to save time. Learn to balance the three factors of exposure. Think of it like this your camera is a device that captures light, there are three independent, yet ultimately linked factors at play in capturing of said light.

Aperture=amount of light let into camera, the more light you let in the less DOF you have, this can be good or bad depending on what you are going for. Conversely the smaller the opening, the more DOF. With real small apertures, there are some image quality issues, but thats a whole different story.

Shutter speed=amount of time light is let into camera, the longer the shutter is open the more you will see blurred motion in the shot, again this depends on what you are looking for, still lifes on a tripod, longer shutter speeds are ok, flying birds you want a quicker shutter speed

ISO= how sensitive camera is to said light, the lower the ISO the less noise. With ISO it's really a game of how low of an ISO you can use depending on what you need for the other two factors. Unless you are looking for grain.

Ok sorry to get off topic, here is what I would try, stop your camera down to say F11, this is the sweet spot for many cameras as far as DOF vs. IQ is concerned. Then set your aperture (or if you really want to, shoot in aperture priority mode). If it is a really long shutter time, bump your ISO up. Now see how close you can focus, use WildW's technique of moving in and out. Turn your focus ring all the way to right (on most lenses), this will focus in as close as possible. When your image is in focus, you are at the minimum focus distance.

I will usually use a tripod to eliminate blurriness from camera shake, but this is kind of a preference issue.

Macro lenses do help a lot, I have heard that macro tubes work well too, but I've never used them. Keep in mind that when working in close, even with a high f stop (small aperture) the DOF will be very shallow. Parts of your image will be out of focus, use this to your advantage. Focus on the important parts of the image and let the other stuff drift into the background.


More than anything, practice. Macro can be a lot of fun, but it really is a game of knowing your camera/lens's limits and walking right to that edge, but not over it. Practice will help you find that edge.

Good luck!

[sarahlou]

I've tried using my Canon 18-55mm & Tamron af 55-200mm. Subjects are mostly flowers, butterflies etc.
I'm still getting to grips with the settings, I've only had the camera a couple of month's ( new hobby) found the on button so far the rest is still a matter of trial and plenty of error!!!!

[A.M.D.A.]

Main thing for taking good pictures:

Practice. :thumbsup: The more you are out taking pictures and changing settings, the more you will learn about your camera.
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I didn't start to take good pictures the very first day I got my lumix, it took a few months to finally have an idea of what settings to use and when to use them.

I checked your profile, the Canon Rebel XTi is a pretty advanced camera. Just go out there and take pictures. Eventually you will learn which settings work best in different situations. Every camera works differently.

[Frog]

I spent 3 hours today trying to get a good sharp shot of some tiger lillys with a tripod and without, using my 18-135 and then my 18-200vr with kenko extension tube....the shortest one worked best and I actually did better without the tripod than with.
I don't do this kind of shooting often and I'm sure practice, practice, practice makes it easier.
Took most of your advice, Dumpy. I did moving back and forth mostly by zooming and then manual focusing

[freygr]

I go to manual focus and aperture priority. Set the f stop to F16 or f32. Frame and Focus and look at the shutter speed. If the shutter speed is low, reset up on tripod.

Yes I get much better DOF this way. Loss of sharpness really is not a problem.

[dumpy]

Hi friends,


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Seriously can we get these people banned? This a**hat has three posts, all of them shilling his stupid site.

Or I have better idea, let's all intentionally not go to it. Boycott for trying to spam us. These people are idiots for thinking we will beleive that they are actual users that had good experiences. Their site might be great, but the actions of this, pardon my french, Dbag, have convinced me never to go to it.

[Frog]

Use the red triangle to report bad posts, dumpy.

[dumpy]

Use the red triangle to report bad posts, dumpy.

Excellent, will do, thanks!!!

[another view]

Seriously can we get these people banned? This a**hat has three posts, all of them shilling his stupid site.

Easy there, hoss!

We look at spam posts as a sign of success - they go to anyplace they think they'll get an audience. I deleted that post (which since you quoted, it'll still show up) and since this has been Reported a couple of times, John will see it. Please watch the "French".

The best way to deal with spam here is to click on the little red triangle at the bottom left of the individual message. That'll shoot an email to moderators and administrators, and the first one to see it will zap it. It's easy for anyone to see the thread titles that talk about deals on Air Jordans, but not immediately obvious about individual spam posts - so we all appreciate your help with this.

[Loupey]

...I'm still getting to grips with the settings, I've only had the camera a couple of month's ( new hobby) found the on button so far the rest is still a matter of trial and plenty of error!!!!

There are entire books written on the subject so don't be under the impression that it is something you can simply set and don't be discouraged if it doesn''t come easily at first.

Practice, learn, and practice some more. Each subject has it's own "setting" at a specific time and place.

In other words, each shot's "setting" will be unique

[SkipT]

Wow great thread, I need to try that with my macro's

Thanks for the info dumpy!!!!!

[Mr Yuck]

Another thing to try with the 18-55mm lens, remove the lens, and then hold it up to the mount, backwards, that is, filter side towards camera.

You get an extremely shallow depth of field, but you can get super close.

[Wild Wassa]

Mr Yuck, spot-on about reversing the lens. With my 35mm I like the 200 on the camera with the 50 reversed and taped on to the front of the 200. With this combo you can see the buttons on an ant's pants, but the depth of field is measured in microns, so you'll only get one of the buttons in focus.

The butterfly wing I though would be flat, and give me a good chance to have the plane of focus parallel to the actual surface. I had no idea that the wing was ridged which made focusing somewhat difficult.

The result is interesting. I like to practice, what I know works for me.





I have no idea what the butterfly is. The shedding of the old scales to reveal new scales is fascinating ... it appears a lot goes on in a short life of a butterfly.

Sarahlou, is this what you meant when you said you wanted to photograph butterflies?

Warren.

[sarahlou]

Wow! what fantastics shots.... I will definately try that. (how did you manage to get sooo close?).
I am so inspired by the amazing photo art on this site..... I only hope i can aspire to be that talented, thankyou for the advice.

[Wild Wassa]

The magnification is at the limit of macro, the absolute limit of being a macro shot.

When the magnification approaches 32X that of the original wing, (this shot is some where between 16-22X magnification including the enlargement), or at greater magnification when photographed, to attempt to reveal greater detail, the shot would need a microscope setup to do it. Just enlarging the wing photo will not show more detail. This is a situation called 'empty magnification', where the image gets larger but reveals no more detail.

I used a bellows to maximum extension. The lighting is from 2 small spot lights specifically for macro setups, and balanced as a main and fill light. Unfortunately they are tungsten spots. The low colour temperature of tungsten light gives the dodgy colour cast and very long exposures. I've corrected the false colour as much as possible, with Canon's Arcsoft program, and the result is close to true.

Between the wing and the lens, I made a little light tent. Just a small cylinder of opalescent paper that rests on the background and with a diameter that slipped over the lens plate of the bellows. Made from tracing paper (like butter paper), to diffuse the light and cut down on specular highlighting and hard edged shadows.

You can see in the top left hand corner that some of the scales have become lustred. Giving fine rainbow effects and appearing over exposured. On the original image the lustre shows up as very fine rainbows. Having gone through Photobucket, before appearing here, the image has just lost the edge of the fine details and overall sharpness.

This was not a hand held shot. The camera, bellows and lens remained fixed at the maximum extension and faced directly towards the floor. The wing was on black velvet to reduce flair, the velvet was placed over a lab jack. The jack was raised and lowered to bring the image into focus.

Sarahlou, it might pay to read up on 'dark field' and 'bright field' lighting techniques for macro. I'm guessing stuff can be found on Google, otherwise I can take a day and detail their set up and use, here. You might find 'dark field' lighting interesting. Even if you don't use it, it will hint on what lighting and simple reflectors can be employed to enhance any macro shot.

There is no lighting for many macro subjects, like coins and other relatively flat objects, that are in relief, like a simple 'dark field' lighting setup, where the light source is behind the subject and wraps around the subject.

I majored in Scientific and Industrial Photography when I was a student, at the Canberra Institute of Technology. This stuff is second nature.

Warren.

[Nick McC]

They also have reversal rings that screw onto the camera so you can mount the lens backwards. No tape required!