Help with S5-is filters + Question about focus

[MaorG]

Hello all, I am new here.

I have a Canon s5 and I wanted to know how can I attach lenses and filters.
If you could name all the parts I would need, it would be great.
Should I buy a 58mm or a 52mm?

And the other question is..
When I picture a very far landscape on 12X zoom and put the focus on infinity, the picture comes out not very sharp.. My friend told me that it is because its a DSLR..
I dont know if he is right, but I hope so.. So I'd know nothing got screwd up.

Thanks alot,
Maor Grab.

[OldClicker]

I knew I had seen this before. Sorry that you did not get any replies on you first try and I won't be much help either.

It is not a DSLR. With a DSLR you can remove the lens and attach a different one. With the S5 you can add adapters, etc. onto the end of your existing lens, but I cannot tell you what or how. Here is a list from Canon of what should work.

http://shop.usa.canon.com/webapp/wcs...0051_-1_169835

The two reasons for blur are camera movement and subject movement. You problem is most likely camera movement. (You need a tripod.) Try setting the camera on something solid and using the timer to actuate the shutter.

TF

[freygr]

I have to Agree with OldClicker, as the longer the focal length you are using the faster you need to set you shutter speed. It is all related to the field of view. The smaller the field of view is the higher the camera movement is magnified. Also the DOF becomes smaller as you decrease you field of view (longer focal lengths). Both less DOF and Camera movement can make the photos "the picture comes out not very sharp"

[MaorG]

First of all, thank you very much for replying me.
Second, It's not because of the shutter speed, it's like the camera cant focus for that long distance, really weird. Do you want me to show you an example of a picture I took with my camera?

I will be glad if someone will answer my other questions.
Thank you!

[Frog]

Yes do show a picture.
On a point and shoot camera you cannot add lenses. You can attach adapters for closeups or too magnify the existing zoom. I would look for the ones by Canon made for that camera.
There are alot of very low quality ones out there.
Scroll down on this page http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/ca...hot_s5-review/
and there is a list of accessories for the camera.

[Photo-John]

Do you want me to show you an example of a picture I took with my camera?

A sample photo is always a good idea. We should easily be able to tell if it's a shutter speed/camera shake problem or if it's actually a focus problem.

For filters, you need to know what filter size. I looked at the Canon and B&H Web sites and it looks like you need a 58mm filter. The 52mm filters would be too small. The only kind of filter that's really useful with a digital camera is a polarizer. Anything else is more esily done with software in post-processing. But the polarizing effect can't really be replicated with software.

[MaorG]

Here are the images:
http://img442.imageshack.us/i/img1674vt.jpg/ - you can see that the bird is more focused than the mountain behind
http://img84.imageshack.us/i/img1665v.jpg/ - you can see that the electrical cables are more focused than the mountain behind

And what do you say about this "kit":
http://cgi.ebay.com/58mm-Lens-Adapte...item1e5b99b796

?

Thanks

[Frog]

You need to use a smaller aperture. At 3.5 is pretty wide, allowing you to have some pretty fast shutter speeds but also a pretty narrow depth of field.

[MaorG]

3.5 what?
And it's 58mm, exactly for my camera.
Why would I have a narrow depth of field?
Can you please give me a link to what I need?

Thank you.

[Frog]

Aperture is how wide your lens opens and is adjustable.
The wider the aperture is, the less depth of field you will have. The smaller it is, the more depth of field.
The tricky part is that smaller apertures have bigger numbers and wider apertures have smaller numbers. So f/16 is much smaller than f/3.5.
Also the smaller apertures need slower shutter speeds because they let in less light so it is a balance between aperture and shutter speed, depending on whether you have moving objects or not.
Aperture, shutter speed, and iso all play a part with one affecting the other.,

Here's the Wikipedia write on aperture http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aperture

Your camera has an 'aperture priority' setting. I would suggest using it by adjusting the apertures and taking the same shot of the same thing as you run through the apertures and then comparing the shots to see the depth of field and how it affects shutter speed.

Let us know if you how it goes. It is confusing at first if you aren't familiar with camera lingo but the light bulb does flash eventually.

[MaorG]

I am sorry but I didn't understand :S
I know what is shutter speed, but I never heared about "aperture".
is the aperture is the adapter? or is it the tube that comes out from the camera when you switch it on?

If I want to buy a CPL and a UV filter, which adapter would I need?
If you can bring me some combinations (if there are) of an adapter and other things I would need it would be great.

Thank you.
by the way, what about the focus problem? I posted the pictures

[Chris350]

Ok I'll wade in. Image http://img84.imageshack.us/i/img1665v.jpg/ with the electrical lines being in focus and the background not, your camera may have "decided for you" that the power lines are the subject of the photo. In making this "decision" the camera focused on the power lines and everything else is ignored. Thus the fuzzy outcome.

Two solutions. One, change your location or point of view to get the power lines out of the picture, you didn't really want pictures of power lines anyway right? Second, you need to become acquainted with how the camera operates in regards to setting the aperture of the lens. This was pointed out up thread. There is a setting (aperture priority AE) that will allow you control (decrease in this case) the lens opening (aperture) and that will increase the quality of the resulting image. The trade off is that as you decrease your aperture, reducing the amount of light, you must also decrease the shutter speed to compensate. If you do not the result is underexposed or dark, fortunately in this mode the camera will set an appropriate shutter speed for the aperture you select. Remember small aperture number lot's of light, fast shutter, smaller range of in focus image. Large aperture number less light, slower shutter, increase range of focused image. Slower shutter speed means you need a solid camera support and/or image stabilization. Also consider "in focus" and "sharp" are not necessarily the same thing. You can have a focused image that is not sharp for many reasons.

Regarding adding filters, why not take the camera to a local shop and have the person there set you up with what you need? It's so much simpler to look at the camera in question that it is to try and guess over the net. You're going to be looking for filters that thread into the front of the lens, therefore it is important to know what the diameter of the lens is. On the topic of filters, the final thing affecting your image quality is the distance between your camera and the distant fields. The air between the subject and the camera detracts and reflects light as it travels to your camera. This will also affect the final image. Recall "in focus vs "sharp". This is why Polarizers and UV filters are recommended in some instances. The attempt to cancel out the randomness of the light passing through your lens. In some cases they may help in some cases they will not.

May this be of some assistance,
Chris

[MaorG]

Thank you Chris for you comment.
But I set the focus on inf. and the background is still blury :S
And about the filters, its easier to go to a local shop but expensive.. a lot more..
The diameter is 58mm for a canon s5-is.

Thanks again.

[Chris350]

You are missing the heart of the information we are trying to pass on. It takes more than simply setting your camera to infinity and pushing the button. You need to learn about and understand how exposure works. Basically exposure is a trade off os shutter speed versus aperture. It is necessary to understand how to trade the two against each other. Next gain a knowledge of how aperture size affects image quality. This is Depth Of Field. Depth of field is the issue you are trying to work around. It is important to understand what the camera controls are doing. It's not quite as simple as pushing a set of buttons and getting a perfect image each time.

If you know that the lens has a 58 mm diameter then you know what size filters to order. Don't want to use your local store? Then how about emailing B&H photo or Adorama in New York with the questions? They will suggest suitable products to meet your needs. Plus that 's what they get paid for.

The benefit of paying a bit more to buy from a local shop is balanced out by the simple fact that you can then go and ask the people there questions such as the ones you are posing here, and they can take the time to show you first hand what it is you're having trouble with in text form.

Finally consider this. That S-5 has a lens that is 6mm to 72mm. It's projecting on to a small digital capture sensor. The camera then uses software to do image magnification (zoom) to an effective 48 times original. It is entirely possible the you are trying to exceed the optical quality of the lens in your subjects. This means the initial image is marginal. Add in software zoom and you are simply exaggerating the low quality of the image. So no matter what you try, if you are attempting to make images that the camera is not suited to produce they are going to be "not sharp". Bottom line, is you will benefit from a fuller grasp of the capabilities and limitations of your camera.

[MaorG]

Ok, thank you.
Shutter speed is the 1\2000 (for example) and the aperture is the F numbers?
I knew that.. I just got confused a bit.
And about the filters, all I am asking for is to know if the only parts I need to put on a filter is the adapter tube and the filter it self?
Is there something more complex than just putting on the filter?

[Frog]

If your lens has threads on the inside front, no adapter is necessary. The filter will go on the lens. Easier than taking them off sometimes so don't thread them down too tight.

[CaraRose]

I am sorry but I didn't understand :S
I know what is shutter speed, but I never heared about "aperture".
is the aperture is the adapter? or is it the tube that comes out from the camera when you switch it on?

Aperture is in the lens itself, it's a diaphram that opens and closes to control the amount of light coming into the camera. It's also commonly called the f-stop.

The aperture controls the amount of light coming through the lens. Your shutter speed controls how long the film (or in the case of digital, the sensor) is exposed to the light.

Your shutter speed and aperture work together to control the exposure.

But each one has different effects depending on how they're set. Shutter speed settings allow you to blur or stop motion. Aperture controls your depth of field (DOF).

Depth of field will control how much of the image can be sharp. The wider the aperture, the more shallow the DOF will be. If you want as much of the image as possible to be sharp, then you want a narrow aperture. If you want just a single subject in focus with the background blurred out, you want to use a wide aperture.

[Chris350]

Ok, thank you.
Shutter speed is the 1\2000 (for example) and the aperture is the F numbers?
I knew that.. I just got confused a bit.
And about the filters, all I am asking for is to know if the only parts I need to put on a filter is the adapter tube and the filter it self?
Is there something more complex than just putting on the filter?

Yep you've got the shutter speed and F-stop (aperture) idea. So in your example, if you shot that at 1/2000 and F3.5, ei wide open aperture and really fast shutter speed, you want to use Aperture Priority AE settings to close the aperture to something closer to f 11 and see where the shutter speed falls. The old rule was to hand hold a shot the shutter speed needed to be approximately 1/focal length of the lens being used. So for example, if your lens is at 80mm you ought to be able to hand hold 1/80th of a second. Image stabilization improves this by about 1-2 stops. So if you know you can hand hold 1/80th, close down your aperture until your shutter speed is at that speed or close. Make the image and if it isn't better quality. Basically you're shooting landscape there so if (BIG IF) you're stationary, and have a good camera support you ought to be able to make that image at small a F-stop and slower shutter speed. This entire discussion changes if you're not stationary, and/or do not have a solid camera support. Again it's a matter of becoming familiar with what each setting does for you in terms of image control. Something you may or may not have seen is this lens is the equivalent of a 35mm to 400mm zoom. So when you set at infinity and run full zoom magnification the shutter speed needs to be in the neighborhood of 1/500 as a starting point.

We've hit the idea of depth of field here pretty well. The other issue that one runs into, is that some lenses perform better at larger F-numbers (smaller Apertures). This is simply a function of the lens design. In general if one wants really high quality images shot wide open (small F-numbers), one spends lots of money on lenses designed to perform well at big apertures. The lenses on most consumer level cameras are going to perform best in the middle of their aperture range. So if you remember one thing from this it would be to try to shoot at the middle of the aperture range of this camera, anywhere from f/5.6 to f/11, provided of course the shutter speed is such that you can hold the camera steady.

[Frog]

From this site http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/ca...hot_s5-review/

The PowerShot S5 has the same F2.7-3.5, 12X optical zoom lens as its predecessor. This lens has a focal length of 6 - 72 mm, which is equivalent to 36 - 432 mm. The lens has an ultrasonic motor, so it moves silently, which is important when it comes time to record movies. While the lens itself is not threaded, you can remove the plastic ring around the lens barrel (by pressing the button to the lower-left) and attach the optional conversion lens adapter. From there you can attach one of the three conversion lenses I mentioned earlier, or any 58 mm filter.

[MaorG]

Thank you Chris for the explanation.
And are you sure about the focal length and the shutter speed? (1/focal length)
Can you explane why is that? Can it be more than 1/focal length?

The S5 has only f/2.7-f/8 so I cant put it on f/11 :S

Thank you frog.
So can I use that simple adapter that I posted here?

[Chris350]

Thank you Chris for the explanation.
And are you sure about the focal length and the shutter speed? (1/focal length)
Can you explane why is that? Can it be more than 1/focal length?

The S5 has only f/2.7-f/8 so I cant put it on f/11 :S

Thank you frog.
So can I use that simple adapter that I posted here?

Honestly I cannot explain the origin of that "rule". I've known it and used it as a guideline forever. It is merely a guideline. All it is giving you is the theoretical lowest shutter speed that one ought to consider when hand holding a lens of a given focal length. Of course it can always be faster than that speed. Faster means you stop motion more effectively. The trade off is that the aperture is larger and you lose depth of field, which is where we started this conversation, with reasons for the lack of image quality you were seeing.

The lens will only stop down to F/8, that's interesting... So for best depth of field you want to be as close to F/8 as possible.
Chris

[MaorG]

You are right!
The aperture was the "problem".
I just tried and it worked
Thank you so much!!

[Frog]

Great! Glad you have a solution.

[MaorG]

Thank you frog.
So can I use a simple adapter?
I mean something like this one: http://www.focalprice.com/DI382B/58m..._S5_Black.html

[Frog]

It says it is for the s5 so I would think you could.