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  1. #1
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    Talking Best entry level DSLR

    I am a Nikon N80 owner that is ready to take the plunge. I'm doing mainly lansdscape/wildlife photography, as well as local rock concert footage from time to time. So I need a good all around DSLR that won't break the bank (around $1200.00).
    Also, am I correct in assuming most of the DSLR's in this price range will be around 6MP? And, would that be the best choice versus going with say the new Nikon/Sony/Canon 8MP fixed lens cameras (in my price range)?

  2. #2
    Faugh a' ballagh Sean Dempsey's Avatar
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    If you have Nikon gear, get a nikon camera.

    D70 is about 1200 with the kit lens
    D100 is about 1500 without a lens.
    D1 or D2H are like 4000.

    For Nikon Digital SLRs, thats all there is.

    Unless you WANT to switch brands, no reason to. Canon has the same cameras in the same price range.
    A good craftsman never blames his tools.

  3. #3
    Sitting in a Leaky Dingy Michael Fanelli's Avatar
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    Don't Forget...

    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Dempsey
    If you have Nikon gear, get a nikon camera.

    D70 is about 1200 with the kit lens
    D100 is about 1500 without a lens.
    D1 or D2H are like 4000.

    For Nikon Digital SLRs, thats all there is.

    Unless you WANT to switch brands, no reason to. Canon has the same cameras in the same price range.
    Don't forget Fuji.
    "Every great decision creates ripples--like a huge boulder dropped in a lake. The ripples merge and rebound off the banks in unforseeable ways.

  4. #4
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    Talking

    Quote Originally Posted by Sean Dempsey
    If you have Nikon gear, get a nikon camera.

    D70 is about 1200 with the kit lens
    D100 is about 1500 without a lens.
    D1 or D2H are like 4000.

    For Nikon Digital SLRs, thats all there is.

    Unless you WANT to switch brands, no reason to. Canon has the same cameras in the same price range.
    So as far as Nikon is concerned I'm looking at the D70. I'm assuming it's a 6MP? Does say a Nikkor lens make up the difference in resolution when comparing to a prosumer 8MP?
    I've got a Tamron 28-200 on my N80 but had heard that the elements on a digital lens bring superior results.
    I don't really have to stay with Nikon, I just want the best camera in the class (I know that's relative).

    Thanks

  5. #5
    Faugh a' ballagh Sean Dempsey's Avatar
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    lenses have nothing to do with megapixels. It's the same resolution no matter what lens you have...

    My Canon 10D produces 6mp images at 3072x2048. Thats how many pixels I get. If I choose to use L series glass, then the light hitting the CMOS will be crisper, but it's the same pixels no matter what.

    The CCD on a D100 is slightly smaller than the Canon flavors, but still just over 6 million pixels.

    I don't have any experience with fixed lens 8mp cameras, so I can't offer any advice.

    You say you want the "Best camera", so I'll answer your objective/relative question with a likewise answer: The D70 probably is the sweeter deal out of all the sub 2000 dollar interchangable SLR's.
    A good craftsman never blames his tools.

  6. #6
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    I have a sony 8mp, and I know now that the 6mp dslr cameras will produce much hihger quality images for a lot of reasons, but mostly for the sensor size. If you already have nikon lenses, a D70 body only is about a grand. I've been researcing a lot and and seriously concidering making the d70 my next camera purchase. The fixed lense cameras a great imo because they have all you need to take pictures right out of the box (except maybe a memory card), but lack the flexibility of interchangeable lenses.

  7. #7
    Sleep is optional Sebastian's Avatar
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    Actually the CMOS on the 10D is slighly smaller, physically. Sean is right though, a good resolving lens will resolve more detail than a poor one. The thing is though, due to the fact that DSLR sensors are MUCH larger than the 8mp consumer sensors, each pixel gets more light, which means less noise and better color, which in turn means better quality images than the consumer cameras.

    I would recommend that you get the D70 and get rid of the poorly performing 28-200.
    -Seb

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    (Please don't edit and repost my images without my permission. Thank you)

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  8. #8
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    Thanks for all the info guys. I do however have one more question. Is it neccesary to purchase a "digital lens" in order for the DSLR to perform properly?

  9. #9
    Faugh a' ballagh Sean Dempsey's Avatar
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    No.

    With Canon, any EF lens will work with the 300D, 10D, 1D and MarkII
    A good craftsman never blames his tools.

  10. #10
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    Thanks Sean.

  11. #11
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    Can I jum p in here

    I was asking this question on the Camera to buy forum, but since you guys are talking about the two cameras I was looking at. Digital rebel Vs Nikon D70 quck question.

    My Salesperson said that in order to get the price down on the Canon they had to cut some features that Photographers might ultimately find limiting. There for the Nikon with Full feature set might be the better buy.....

    I have scoured reviews and tech specs, but couldnt figure out what features cannon might have dropped.

    Any one know?

    Thanks

    Peplogiv

  12. #12
    Faugh a' ballagh Sean Dempsey's Avatar
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    Well, depending on your perspective, they didn't "drop" anything, the Digital Rebel has the same features it always had.

    The comparison is to the very similar 10D, but the rebel isn't a "10D minus features", its a rebel. They are similar, they are siblings, but they are different cameras. The 10D has a higher ISO, a bigger buffer (9 shots compared to 4), mirror lockup, custom functions, a metal body, a slightly faster focus system... It's worth the extra cash imo.

    I found the Rebel limiting and grabbed a 10D, and I love the 10D, and I am a big fan of Canon. The D70 is a nice camera, but my goal is a 1D Mark II, so I don't miss Nikon.

    For me, I have to decide "what do I want to end up with?" Even if I had to start over, I'd go canon, because I'd rather have a Canon 1D and a Canon 600mm IS lens. So if you are looking between Canon and Nikon, I'd say look between the 10D and the D70, not the Rebel. The D70 is by far ahead of the Rebel, it's not fair to compare. In fact, the D70 is atop the D100 probably.

    What kind of lenses do you want, what kind of future gear do you want?
    A good craftsman never blames his tools.

  13. #13
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    Canon Vs Nikon.

    Sean thanks for the help.....I was think about the Digital rebel and Nikon , because they were both under or around 1200....the 10D with lenses is going to be about 200K and up....so you can se I am partially price driven. The lenses I was choosing between are the Canon 28-135 IS. It is an excellent lens, but a bit expensive. I know the Canon 28-105 also has a good reputation. What do you thnk!

  14. #14
    Faugh a' ballagh Sean Dempsey's Avatar
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    I actually don't know those lenses.

    But I am curious as to what you are considring and why. 1200 bucks... lets see

    Rebel with crap kit lense: $899

    D70 with no lens: $999
    D70 with decent lense: $1299

    10D with no lens: $1499
    D100 with no lens: $1499

    To me, a few hundred bucks isn't a big deal. You figure you have this camera for just a year, thats not very much money spread out.

    There's a few articles about saving money.... one of the best ways to save money is to buy higher end gear up front. Why? Because if you are at all serious about SLR photography, then in 6 months with your Rebel, you'll be saying "man, I kinda want a 10D..." or if you're like me, a Mark II... Same with tripods. Dont' buy that 50 dollar one at walmart... buy the 200 dollar Bogen or a Gitzo, otherwise after a month of being disappointed in your tripod, you'll get the good one anyways and have a 50 dollar piece of junk.
    A good craftsman never blames his tools.

  15. #15
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    Sean,

    Right Now I have a Compact Digital Canon Powershot G2. I got it when I became a father to take pictures of the baby. 5 months and 900 photos later I have found that I really love taking photos and it's something that i want to turn into more of a hobby. Keep in mind I have never taen a photography class (those are coming). and the reason why I am selling my Powershot G2 (and it takes really good pictures), is because there is not enough zoom. I started looking at the Konica Minolta Dimage z2, because of the 10X otical and the sports photo features, but by the time you buy memory cards and lithium batteries you can be at 700 bucks....At that point I looked at DSLR and the Digital Reble fell close to that range with the Kit price of 899 on the web....Pretty cool I thought.....Then I read the reviews the echoe what you said and that is while the Digital rebel is great...ultimately the Nikon and Canon D10 are more feature rich.

    Primarily I am still taking pictures of my baby and as she gets ready to run I wanted a Point and shoot that would take pictures with mimum lag time. Cannon has some cool zoom lenses the one that comes with the kit, or the 28mm-105mm, but the lense can be over 300$ depending on where you go. so my dilema is Does theauto AF issue ultimately going to affect me......Will I get that much more by going to the D70...(the D10 is way out of the price range!

    Your thoughts???

  16. #16
    Liz
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    Now I'll step in.....

    If I were you, I'd stick with the Rebel. You've gone from spending $500 to $800 on the Rebel (plus a lens). If you get a 10D, you're talking a lot more money. You could choose the D70, but with the "kit" lens that is also about $1300. For what you want it for, I think the 10D is overkill. You have to take the type of lenses into consideration also. You can always begin with the 50mm/f1.8 for $75. It's a good lens and will get you started while you decide which other lens you want.

    Just my humble opinion. Depends on where you see yourself going with photography in the next 2 or so years.

    Liz

  17. #17
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    50mm/f1.8

    Liz, correct if me I am wrong but the 50mm/f1.8 has no zoom option. Correct?

  18. #18
    Liz
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    Correct.......however

    Many people have that lens because it's easy, sharp, good focal length, small and convenient. You have to use your legs as the zoom!

    I only suggested it due to the fact that it's a great lens and only $75 and you could use your new camera and take your time making a decision as to which zoom to get! However, I know the feeling of wanting a zoom right away. Twice I've purchased a kit lens not knowing what else to buy, and twice I sold it within a month. That was for the Rebel 2K and the Rebel 300D.

    It's not easy to make these decisions. Sometimes it's frustrating.......but when you get that camera..........it will be worth every brain cell you used to make the decision !

    Liz

  19. #19
    Faugh a' ballagh Sean Dempsey's Avatar
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    There's no such thing as a good, cheap zoom.

    a "10x" doesn't mean anything. My main zoom is a 4x... 100mm to 400mm. a 10x could mean 10mm to 100mm, or 200mm to 2000mm.

    If you don't foresee yourself wanting a more prosumer level camera, the rebel is cool, the 18-55 kit lens is decent, and you can always grab a longer zoom if you want.

    If you have a budget though, just buy within that. And unless you want to drop the extra few hundred for the D70, it looks like the rebel is gonna fit you best.
    A good craftsman never blames his tools.

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