Really Basic Practical Question

[JohnGalt_ny]

I have a 450D/XSi, a 580 EX and a 430 EX. None of them have sync ports.

If I get a pair of Cybersync receivers and a Cybersync transmitter, how do I get the Cybersyncs to connect to and fire the Speedlights? Is there something else to buy?

Thanks in advance.

[Asylum Steve]

If I get a pair of Cybersync receivers and a Cybersync transmitter, how do I get the Cybersyncs to connect to and fire the Speedlights? Is there something else to buy?

I assume these are hot shoe flashes, right? I've never used wireless transmitters with hs flashes, so don't take my word as gospel, but you probably will need an add-on sync module such as something from safesync:

http://www.weinproducts.com/safesyncs.htm

I'd find a good camera store and talk to them...

[drg]

John,

Forget the Cybersync's with Speedlite flashes unless they have the PC sync socket as with the 580EX II versions.

Canon has the Speedlite wireless ST-E2 system which maintains all ETL functionality. In other words it is just like have the flash mounted on the camera, with thru the lens metering of the flash and auto-quenching, etc.

Not cheap, but a very rugged workable system. The ST-E2 run about $200. But they work!

I haven't mixed and matched 5xx and 4xx series for awhile, but I think there's a catch. I'll check my notes.

Pocket wizards are another good choice of a similar flash control product.

Any other questions let us know.

[JohnGalt_ny]

Thanks guys.

PWs are out of budget since I need three units. I was looking at Csyncs as a reasonable alternative.

I've seen the STE2 but I'd like to go radio rather than LOS infrared. Maybe I'll change that.

Will Cyncs just not work with speedlites?

[drg]

John,

Cybersync builds their product to work primarily with a particular brand of lights and controls, namely products that come from AlienBees. The range of controls and information that you see listed at their website depends upon the strobe/flash unit that it, the Cybersync, is ultimately hooked up to and the other equipment in the chain.

The best you can acheive most likely for any reasonable cost using Speedlites like you have, is for the Speedlites to function as manual slave units.

The cost issue: EACH Speedlite would need one of the Receivers at $70-90 each, plus a transmitter for your camera. Right there you've paid for a Speedlite ST-E2 IR transitter.

Plus you would need an adapter for each of 'your' Speedlites as they don't come with a PC type connection. Additionally your 450D doesn't have PC connector either, another $25-40 adapter. Then add cables. . .

The Speedlite ST-E2 does give better control of your units. Not just a manual setting!

If what you are wanting is a low cost 'studio setup' a better consideration might be to purchase just that! The lights/strobes are not always the best but it might be more economical. Generally you do get more for your money in terms of durability and reliability if you pay a little more and stay with brand names.

The Cybersyncs are OK products, but are part of a usually much more elaborate set up.

I prefer Radio triggers myself. I do use IR for a quick and effective solution with some regularity. IR doesn't get messed up in electrical 'rich' enviroments and has the ability to use, with most setups, optical/visible light slave units as well.

Wireless certainly beats tripping over wires, ahh for the good old days, NOT! It does come with a cost and systems are not usually very, if at all, compatible.

If we knew more about your application, it might be easier to make a specific suggestion or two and to give you an idea of costs.

Steve (asylumsteve) made a very good suggestion that you find a good store/supplier and go in and see what they have. Basic lighting isn't difficult technically, it does require though that you have what you need to get certain effects in the end product.

I hope this helps a bit more!

[Asylum Steve]

The best you can acheive most likely for any reasonable cost using Speedlites like you have, is for the Speedlites to function as manual slave units...

This is a great point. I was meaning to mention it myself...

The only distinct advantage radio triggers have over photo-electric slave triggers is that slaves need some sort of line of sight to activate. Radio signals go through, well...anything radio signals are capable of going through: wall, doors, panels, trees, hills, small animals, etc.

You can get much more creative with your light placement as far as hiding lights in and behind things with radio triggers. Also, having a multple channel feature gives you great flexibility firing more than one light setup without leaving the camera position.

Other than that, slaves are much more economical (many flash units have them built in), and for the vast majority of lighting setups accompish the exact same thing as transmitters.

When I'm running multiple monolights, I normally radio trigger the main light, then fire the others using their slaves...

[JohnGalt_ny]

Thanks drg and Steve for the comprehensive answer.

I don't really have a setup in mind. As I said, I'm a hobbyist about 3 years in and just starting to play with off camera flash. It's tough for me to justify a studio lighting setup at this point.

My reason for wanting radio instead of IR comes from my wanting to put a flash behind my model as a background light. Unfortunately, that hides the IR from the 580EX control so the STE-2 doesn't appear to solve that problem.

At this point, given my lack of experience, studio and budget I'm probably better off just getting another used 430EX and or a reflector and triggering it all from the 580EX onboard. If and when I can do actual studio portraits I'll revisit studio strobes and lights.

Thanks again to all for the responses. Anyone else?

[SmartWombat]

Unfortunately, that hides the IR from the 580EX control so the STE-2 doesn't appear to solve that problem.

But your SET-2 doesn't need to be on the camera.
You can use the fully ETTL compatible flash extender cord to move the controller about until it does have a view of the flash behind the subject.
Also, despite being alledgedly line of sight, like a TV remote you can bounce the infrared off nearby surfaces.

I discovered with my 580EXII on camera as master, it would quite happily trigger a fill flash 580EX that was behind me and to the right, because there was plenty to bounce the IR about.

So line of sight for most reliable certainly, but that doesn't mean it can't be made to work !

[Asylum Steve]

I discovered with my 580EXII on camera as master, it would quite happily trigger a fill flash 580EX that was behind me and to the right, because there was plenty to bounce the IR about...

Thanks Paul. All this is useful real world info that can sometimes be tough to figure out on one's own...

BTW, I posted before I realized we're talking about IR triggers. I have no experience with those, and of course they're a different animule. When I talk about line of sight with photo-electric slaves, it's pretty hard to cheat...