What can I do..?

[Canyon]

Hi, Judging by theses photos, can anyone please advise what I can do on my next visit, to make the photos better....?

I had a manual zoom lens on this night and to be honest, I found it v v difficult to get most/any of my shots in focus. Can anyone please tell me, if this is what the problem is...?, and whether getting an AF lens of similar quality would sort the problem, or is there something else I need to do....?

Much appreciated

Danny

[Old Timer]

Need a bit more information on what equipment and settings Danny. The primary problem at first would appear to be WB. But if you were shooting film than it was the type you were shooting that didn't balance with your light source. At any rate give us a bit more info and we'll try ans sort it out for you.

PS: Just noticed you had another post on this subject. It appears this is with the D60 and the manual lens you mentioned. Most of us shot basketball and other sports for years before AF became standard, is it possible to get good pics, most differently. I once again go back to the WB question, how was it set? It seems to be WB and Exposure that are the main concerns not focus in the images you posted.

[Canyon]

Thanks very much

I was using a Nikon D60 with a sigma 24-70 f2.8 lens ( I borrowed the lens as the last photos were even worse lol).

The ISO settings were set to HI1, as anything lower was just too dark still. The WB was set to to either incandescant or flourescent, I flicked between the two. Aperture was set to f.28 and shutter speed was around 1/250.

I have just come back from the camera store that sold the sigma lens to me, and given it back as I need AF for sport. He suggested, that the problem was the body more than anything else, and the D60 is not exactly fit for purpose in thie instance. He suggested I upgrade to a D300 and get a Nikon 18-105mm f3.5-5.6 G ED AF-S VR DX Lens which would suit my purposes without having to fork out ridiculous money (or more ridiculous anyway). It would be v useful to get your advice on this thought if possible...?

To cut a long story short, I am enjoying doing the photography and would like to focus on sports (no pun intended). I am happy to pay a little extra on a body/lens, if it allows me to take good shots over the opportunities above. It is not big league stuff. From this point I can progress....... Obviously would be good to be able to use the camera for other purposes too....;-)

Thanks again for your help

Canyon

[Old Timer]

The D300 will be a much better performing body for sports no doubt about it. I however would question the purchase of a lens that aperture of f3.5 -5.6. In my experience they are just not fast enough for indoor sports. I'm aware that budget concerns must be taken into consideration so I would suggest looking for a good used lens that with an f2.8 aperture. I purchased a 28-70 f2.8 Nikkor lens on Ebay and use it very successfully for basketball. A good all round sports lens is the Nikkor 80-200mm f2.8 and you can find them many time at a very good price. As to the WB problem try a custom WB or use the Auto WB and see if that doesn't help.

[Canyon]

Many thanks again for the feedback.

I am thinking I will go for the D300 upgrade as suggested. As far as lenses go, I may just have to hire in the short term and I'll look for a 2nd hand f2.8 Nikkor lens.

Thanks again for the help.

[Frog]

Also if you shoot in raw format, it will be quite simple to fix the white balalnce in post processing.

[Canyon]

Is there much I can do about these photos, or are they a lost cause...?

And if I were to take the same photos again (with settings mentioned above), with the D300, would they come out a lot sharper....?.

I just dont want to buy a different camera now and get the same/similar results...?!

[Old Timer]

The D300 will give you better noise control at higher ISO setting and should with the right lens give you quicker AF. The only thing that will help the overall quality is the proper WB and exposure.

[jacobovs]

Agree with all of the above, the store lens recommendation is suspect. Also one tip that I can add is to shot vertically. Basketball is an up and down sport mostly, I noticed all of the shots were horizontal.

[SmartWombat]

Looks like you were shooting in a dark dungeon of a gym

Thanks for leaving the EXIF intact, I can see a lot about the images...

Your shutter speed is barely adequate at 1/250 second to stop motion blur.
I see the white balance was fixed on white fluorescent, auto WB may have been better.
They look under exposed, and the EXIF says manual control - how did you meter the exposure ?
The first two are out of focus, but all are under-exposed.

The big problem is that you have poor light.
I guess from the colour they are sodium lights which emit mostly orange light.
So getting a true colour will be difficult.

Flash may be the only solution in this gym, and you may not be allowed to use flash.
So if there is a reason you can't use a few relatively cheap flashes on stands, and pocketwizard radio triggers ...

I don't know what speed HI1 is (1600?) and there is already a lot of noise in the image.
If you have even higher ISO, try it.
And do not be tempted to under-expose to get faster shutter speed.
Even over-expose by maybe 1/3 to 1/2 stop.

I don't think you'll get a lot of benefit out of better, fast lenses.
I use Canon 70-200 f.2.8 L IS, I think the equivalent Nikkor would be 80-200 f/2.8 VR
But in this gym that wouldn't improve things much, you get autofocus and zoom - but no more light than with the 50mm f/2.8.

BUT the shop recommendation of f/3.5 smaller aperture is wrong, you need widest aperture you can get - and you've shown f/2.8 isn't enough - to get more light, not less.

After an expensive lens, the next step is an expensive body.
One that will give less noise in the image at ISO1600 or 3200.

But first I would want to see what you can do with this equipment before spending a small fortune !!
Turn up the ISO as fast as you can, get the exposure right (use the histogram).
Try pre-focussing on the edge of the D and shoot when they get there - that will solve the focus issue. Or pre-focus on the basket, flip the camera to portrait orientation, and shoot as they score.

If you can get well exposed images that way, then you can work on white balance, and noise reduction software to improve the picture.

But having done it myself (bought 1D bodies) I wouldn't throw money at the problem yet ...



EXIF information:
Camera Make = NIKON CORPORATION
Camera Model = NIKON D60
Software/Firmware Version = Adobe Photoshop 7.0
Last Modified Date/Time = 2009:03:19 10:22:05
Exposure Time (1 / Shutter Speed) = 10/2500 second = 1/250 second = 0.004 second
Lens F-Number/F-Stop = 28/10 = F2.8
Exposure Program = manual control (1)
Original Date/Time = 2009:03:18 20:43:57
Digitization Date/Time = 2009:03:18 20:43:57
Exposure Bias (EV) = 0/6 = 0
Max Aperture Value (APEX) = 30/10 = 3
Max Aperture = F2.83
Metering Mode = pattern / multi-segment (5)
Light Source / White Balance = cool white fluorescent (14)
Flash = Flash did not fire
Focal Length = 520/10 mm = 52 mm
Colour Space = sRGB (1)
Image Width = 800 pixels
Image Height = 536 pixels
Exposure Mode = manual exposure (1)
White Balance = manual (1)
Focal Length in 35mm Film = 78
Scene Capture Type = standard (0)
Gain Control = high gain up (2)
Contrast = normal (0)
Saturation = normal (0)
Sharpness = normal (0)

[Canyon]

Sorry, been away on annual leave. I really appreciate all this information, many thanks for taking time out to help with this. I'll be shooting another match tomorrow and will try out the above recommendations. Will let you know how I get on!!
Thanks again