Strobe Hassles

[JBPhoto]

Tuesday night was my second outing with my strobes. I walked into a visiting gym and asked asked the administrator in charge if he'd mind if I set up my lights. He asked about them, where they would be etc., then said "sure", and identified himself as a photography enthusiast. So I set them up and about six shots in, a guy on the home bench yelled across the gym to knock off the flash. Turns out, I knew the guy and at halftime of the JV game I asked if he was serious (since he had a smile on his face). He said a few parents said "what the hell', and felt it was distracting to the players (they were in the corners of the gym, 13' up and pointed at the ceiling). The varsity coach walked up and asked if I was with the paper. I said "no, but they use them so whats the difference". He said that "they have a right to be here". Obviously, I said "well so do I", to which he was speechless. I gave him the out and asked if he wanted me to take them down. He did, so I did. Fortunately the gym was bright enough that I was able to get some good shots with my f/1.8 shooting ISO 800 @ 1/500. The varsity players saw me taking them down and were disappointed, asked why, so I told them that the coach thought they were distracting to the players. They smirked. My son plays on the team that was visiting, he says he dosen't even notice them. I suggested to the guy I knew (later on) to ask his players if, in fact, they are distracting. I anticipate the same hassle when this team plays in our house.

[livin4lax09]

I was just talking a photographer last night about his instances with strobes. he *claims* that once a guy came over to his stobes during a hockey game, pulled the plug out, and tried to break the bulb, because it was distracting his goalie and he was missing saves. He was just pissed because his goalie was playing crappy, and looking for someone to blame it on. he then proceeded to spit on the strobe and the cops were called.

In reality, if the players are concentrating on the game, they shouldn't be bothered at all. my dad was in the stands of a bball game and remarked he didnt even notice the strobes going off, and he was only watching. In the heat of game it won't get to you. Whenever I played lacrosse, I never noticed when someone was shooting with flash, even right in front of me. If they're being bounched off the ceiling it's even less distracting, because the players arent being exposed to barebulb.

A lot of coaches just like to blame their failures on something other than the players.

[JBPhoto]

I agree with all of this. I suggested that strobes firing at 1/3200 of a second, thirteen feet in the air and pointed up are probably the least intrusive use of flash (aside from being mounted in the rafters). I was at a game about a month ago and there was a guy with a 70-200 with flash on a bracket shooting straight on from the baseline. THAT, in my opinion, is intrusive. This guy is the GM of the bball teams for that high school. He referred to the varsity coach as a rookie, coached freshmen for one season previously, and he blamed his concern on that. I told him the lights would be up when they come to our gym and he referred me to the state hs basketball regs, that if a coach complains they must come down. This coach obviously hasn't been to any "big shows" yet. I can't be confrontational, I have to abide by the rules. But, I can try to convince him that the players don't notice them, and they DO want great shots of themselves.

[livin4lax09]

just ask him to ask his players. say "here, we'll ask together. Johnny, are these lights really bothering you to the point you want them taken down, or do you want well-lit photos of yourself?" I know what i'd answer.

[JSPhoto]

Flash at the baseline shouldn't affect them at all, they should be looking up and consentrating on the game, not the photographer or the flash.
Funny though, but newspaper photogs do get a lot more leeway than others. I have had refs come up and ask who I am shooting for, as soon as I say the "paper" they leave me alone.
However when visiting it is best to stop using the flash if the "locals" complain. I have found that the problem is, in many cases jealousy that someone is covering the other team and not them.

JS

[WsW-WYATT-EARP]

when do we get to see some photos from these bees ????

[livin4lax09]

Flash at the baseline shouldn't affect them at all, they should be looking up and consentrating on the game, not the photographer or the flash.
Funny though, but newspaper photogs do get a lot more leeway than others. I have had refs come up and ask who I am shooting for, as soon as I say the "paper" they leave me alone.
However when visiting it is best to stop using the flash if the "locals" complain. I have found that the problem is, in many cases jealousy that someone is covering the other team and not them.

JS

JS is very right here, as I almost never shoot on the road. I primarily shoot home games so that when something goes wrong, I can be backed up by the AD, coaches, and refs if I have already talked to them, which i try to do before every game. WHole different story on the road though.

[JBPhoto]

Yeah, I pretty much decided that its not worth it to take them on the road. You never know where the power is, hostile people, etc. I have full support from the ADs at my home gyms so I'll probably just keep it to that.

Here are some shots from last night, Coast Guard Academy vs. MIT. ISO 400, varied f/2.8 to f/4.0, 1/250th.

[dhyravy]

Man JB, that stinks! I have not had any resistance to flash at our home gym yet. But a young lady from a visiting teams' local paper showed up at the last game with an AB800 and had it poorly positioned which drew a lot of negative comments from the crowd and some of the players. Fortunately, that night I was shooting ambient and didn't get involved in the issue. I may wait a game or two before trying my setup.

[WsW-WYATT-EARP]

WOW JB very nice shots !!!! I am guessing you are happy with the bees then ??? how do you guys set these up for shots like this ??? maybe take a shot of your set up next game ???

Daniel - you would think that someone from the paper would know how to set the strobes up without being intrusive to the players / game / spectators ...

[JSPhoto]

JS is very right here, as I almost never shoot on the road. I primarily shoot home games so that when something goes wrong, I can be backed up by the AD, coaches, and refs if I have already talked to them, which i try to do before every game. WHole different story on the road though.

I still use flash when I travel, I have done it long enough though all the schools around know me, heck, even the refs know me by name....not sure if thats good or bad though They are so used to me that they know which papers I shoot for as well. It's kind of nice as I do tend to get places other shooters don't, and never get questioned.

JS

[Old Timer]

Yeah, I pretty much decided that its not worth it to take them on the road. You never know where the power is, hostile people, etc. I have full support from the ADs at my home gyms so I'll probably just keep it to that.

Here are some shots from last night, Coast Guard Academy vs. MIT. ISO 400, varied f/2.8 to f/4.0, 1/250th.

Very impressed with your results. Your making me think maybe I should just wait till i can afford the right equipment before jumping to a setup I can afford but may not do the job. Number three is a great sport-portrait if that the right word. Got to love the results you got there. Take a bow on these you deserve it.

[JBPhoto]

Ben - yeah, I'm very happy with the Bees. Though I am going to upgrade to the 11" reflector for a longer throw. I would normally have them on 13' stands at opposing corners at one end of the court, pointed 45 degrees to the top of the key to bounce off the ceiling. But last night I had them at opposite ends of the court since there were no accessible outlets on one side. I shoot with a 70-200 f/2.8 and position myself along the baseline or sideline, about 10' from the corner in either direction. This was only my second time out with them but so far so good.

[JBPhoto]

Thanks very much OT. I was happy with these results - and my batteries are charging for tonight.

[JSPhoto]

Sorry, I couldn't resist. These two were from tonights action in one of the strangest gyms I have shot in. I LOVE the lighting in this place but it's very odd. They have can lights in a solid ceiling. The ceiling and walls are white, and even though the lights are recessed and there really are not that many of them they give off the best light for shooting. Even the TV crews who were at the game love it there. These were shot at 800 ISO and I was using between 200-400 shutter speed the whole time I was there. It doesn't hurt though that you can easily shoot down on the action here as well as from the floor.

JS

[livin4lax09]

yeah, that angle is great, though it must make shooting the action right in front of the basket tough. Shame about the shadow right across the face in the second shot, but other than that it looks awesome.

[JSPhoto]

Just step one way or another sideways and you can get in front of the net. I was only there the first half due to dealine so I didn't play too much, got what I needed and left.

Today I may wish I had strobes, wrestling and basketball in really bad gyms

JS

[rovowen]

Newbie here.
I want to thank all of you for posting and letting all of see your photos.
I have been afraid to use any kind of flash because of disturbing the players. Rethinking
now on getting strobes and lighting to help.
But before, I set anything up for a game. I will ask the coach and AD about setting up during a practice and see how all goes from there.
Thank All of You For Your Knowledge
rovowen

[JSPhoto]

Welcome to the forum, great to see another Indiana shooter here too.
If you have flash questions for here in Indiana just ask me or check out the IHSAA website as they have the rules on flash for each sport.
Well I am off to shoot the wrestling now, then pop in at home for the Colts game and then it's off to basketball again..

JS

[dhyravy]

I just found out that the local HS is getting new lights in the gym!! The AD was talking to me at a game and mentioned it. I took the opportunity to ask if they had given any thought to light temperature to which he gave me a puzzled look. Needless to say I took the advantage of the moment to suggest that they consider something around the 3500 - 5000 K range. If they can, it would change everything for me and the others trying to shoot at that facility.

[JSPhoto]

I am constantly on two AD's in the county about their gym lighting, and may pay off at one school. Since the new construction plans do not include a new gym he's now going to try and get the district to relight the gym....mostly because of all the photogs complaining

There is a down side to this however....my property taxes will go up to pay for it

JS