Mountain Horse.

[Mcphisto]

I took this picture whilst on holidays in Wales. I experimented a bit in CS3 to get more colour out of it, but not too much, I also think that maybe the horse could be more 'off center'. What do you think? Here's a link to the picture. Sorry I couldnt put it up with the post but I was having problems and the baby needs bathing!

http://gallery.photographyreview.com...&ppuser=256071


Mcphisto

[jgredline]

I guess allot depends on what your after with the photo.
If you are looking to show the ''horse'', then a tighter crop with some sharpening would be good, atleast to me..If your after a shot that shows the landscape and are using the horse to show the context of the photo, then I would crop half the sky out and much of the bottom as well to give the photo the ''wide landscape look'' I would also sharpen the pic a little as well...Keep in mind that these are merely the opinions of an amateur...me..

I did download the photo and crop it and can post it if ''you'' like..To some it may look better and to others it may not..

[Mcphisto]

Feel free to do whatever, I appreciate your opinions. Thanks. :-)

[jgredline]

OK
Here is the original you posted only resized to fit here.


Here is the same pic with a little crop and sharpening.


Here is the second pic with a tighter crop.


Like I said. There is not much of a difference and I too am learning...I look forward to hearing what some of the other folks say...All in all I really like your pic..

[Mcphisto]

Yep, I am with you on this one, it looks good, not a lot of difference but there is less distraction, which is always good. I am only learning myself and this is the way to do it! Thanks again. :-)

[jgredline]

Thank you for taking the cc in a good light...Before I Joined this forum, I belonged to another where I would post up pics for advice and there was a group of 7 folks that only ''venom'' came from their key boards...In fairness there was a bunch of really good folks their as well...Anyway, it was through those nice folks that I learned allot and I have a long way to go...one of the things they taught me, was that cropping was one of the most important if not the most important part of a photo..When shooting animals and landscapes, the sharpening tool can be your best friend because it brings out the colors in the picture....

You are correct in that there is very little difference in your picture and the cropped ones. It really comes down to the placement of the horse and what you are trying to convey.....Had the picture been another forum, I would have looked at it and said...What a cool pic...

Have a blessed day and take care.
javier

[freygr]

The photo reminded me of Eastern Oregon High Desert, but then I saw Wales. I always envisioned Wales as forested.

The cropped photo is much better than the original. I always try to compose in the camera using the zoom. As with film (35mm) and even more so with digital, cropping limits your enlarging ability.

[Didache]

It's s nice pic ... a very nice pic in fact, and very evocative of Wales. It sparked memories - the very last time I was on a horse, was in the Brecon Beacons area of Wales .. I had just met my future wife then. In a way it was a "first date". Our eldest child is 26 now and about to get married - which shows how long it's been since I was in a saddle!

Mike

[Mcphisto]

Well I am gald you liked it, all of you. Wales has its forests but its mostly mountainous sheep farming kind of country. Very beautiful, visit if you get the chance. I'm going to post another Welsh pic for critique! Different theme though!

[threelions usa]

It's s nice pic ... a very nice pic in fact, and very evocative of Wales. It sparked memories - the very last time I was on a horse, was in the Brecon Beacons area of Wales .. I had just met my future wife then. In a way it was a "first date". Our eldest child is 26 now and about to get married - which shows how long it's been since I was in a saddle!

Mike

i really thought the crop helped and i am struggling with cropping right now so this was a great example .. thanks for the indirect help..

also D...

hate to go there but really i am not sure you should have used this particular vernacular..

[MarcusK]

Mcphisto, Looking at the original one thing is for sure the colors needed to come out, and the composition had to be a little different.... although... for a memory this is one heck of a shot!

Here's an elaboration based on J's (may i call you J?) edits:

In the first edit (second posted photo) the colors are better and the sharpening works.... however the composition remains a problem for me, since the horse is too centered!

Which takes us to the second photo... the horse is dead center.... usually this does not make for an interesting photo... a little off center to the right would make it much better!

Also with sharpening and fixing the colors you might realize that the horses face gets washed out...


One thing about cropping... as was mentioned it should be a last resort since you will lose resolution from the picture... Digitally speaking... if possible you wanna shoot RAW and post process as little as possible leaving cropping to the very end! it is always best not to edit jpegs since each time you will be compressing on save and thus losing more and more detail or color information!

Looking for better composition while shooting makes post processing all the more easier and simpler (the one thing i keep struggling with.... got better... but still)

Hope this helps

Marc

[Mcphisto]

It sure does. I would have used RAW but I was expecting to take lots of pics and needed room on the card (buy another soon, after my kayak, macro and telephoto lenses).

Mcphisto

[threelions usa]

Markus another very valuable piece of indirect information.

having read virtually EVERY thread about composition/lighting and how you now offer information on rather to shoot raw and save cropping, i think that is something else that i can add.

even if one doesn't post a photo at all, i think i have learned an awful lot that can help with what i am trying to do. and that is learn.

while i may not comment of a lot of stuff (i feel intimidated as i know absolutely nothing ~ although nothing is very often a good thing because i don't have any bad habits to change)
i find that i can take bits of this and bits of that and apply it (hopefully) to something that i may do next time out. it often lends me NOT to do what i may have done and so shortcuts me to something else.

for those of you who post critique on specifics, there is ALWAYS something that we can take albeit a better crop, composition etc.so if you can offer at least a little something on every post it can and often does help others.

thanks again for the time.


costs for this mega bucks
costs for that mega mega bucks
for everything else .... there is pr.com

[Greg McCary]

I think I like the composition of the first one and the color treatment of the last one. I would also clone the white object behind and to the right of the horse. The horses forehead also seems a little bright. I might would try burning it slightly. Great image though.
Greg

[MarcusK]

threelions, one thing i love is learning... I am naturally curious... always on the look out for bettering myself... What i love about this forum, is the fact that everyone here is out to help... Which is why usually i post the photos that leave a question mark in my mind. Once in a while... I have a great photo i wanna share.... but even then... there will always be something that someone sees.

What i am trying to say basically, is I started off, not really wanting to critique... but critiquing is also a very crucial learning tool. For sometimes, if there is anything "wrong" or incorrect about your critique, someone will correct with proof or extra info... This is how I learned a lot since i first joined up here!

Post photos - post comments - post a lot... We will all always need the help and criticism!

Mcphisto, RAW does take up more space and makes PPing the photos a necessity i know... I carry 8GB in cards.... but when i am out there... unless out spending the day with the purpose of shooting anything i see, rarely do i find the need to go beyond 2GB.... each GB can hold up to 100+ photos.

Here's a very interesting "conversation" from a fun website:
http://www.thatsmymonkey.com/Pages/0201rawvjpeg.html

Cheers,
Marc

[MarcusK]

P.S: When out shooting, i rarely go not knowing what i might need. Which is why basically I always have everything with me

But again... on average... 2x 1GB cards or just a good 2GB card should be enough most of the time! at least long enough for you to download them onto the computer!

[Didache]

also D...

hate to go there but really i am not sure you should have used this particular vernacular..

Grief! I had to think about that for a moment .. I would blush if I weren't so shameless :blush2:

For the record, we went on to have three more kids. The youngest is 18 so you can draw your own conclusions

Cheers
Mike

[DrRoebuck]

... and i am struggling with cropping right now ...

Might I suggest that you forget you even have a crop tool? As others have said, force yourself to compose the image when you're actually taking the photograph. If you take a shot and you think "Man, I can crop most of that out," don't do it. Use it as a lesson to get in closer next time and use more deliberation when framing your images. This is something I'm learning to do as I pay more attention to composition. The only time I crop, usually, is when I'm trimming some distracting detail from the edge of the picture that I didn't notice while I was shooting (or that didn't appear in my viewfinder ).

[Greg McCary]

Might I suggest that you forget you even have a crop tool? As others have said, force yourself to compose the image when you're actually taking the photograph. If you take a shot and you think "Man, I can crop most of that out," don't do it. Use it as a lesson to get in closer next time and use more deliberation when framing your images. This is something I'm learning to do as I pay more attention to composition. The only time I crop, usually, is when I'm trimming some distracting detail from the edge of the picture that I didn't notice while I was shooting (or that didn't appear in my viewfinder ).

I agree with the Dr. When shooting I usally will try several shots, some with the horizon in the upper third and some in the lower and even some in the middle. But with the horse I would imagine your time was limited to when the animal was posing for you. Keep up the good work.

[jgredline]

I agree totally that croping should be avoided, but in this case, as Greg pointed out, the horse or moving subjects are not going to stand still forever...
Dr.
We do not know the situation..What if the picture was taken from a tour bus? or a on the other side of a River? The OP did not say...To say forget you have a crop tool is silly...The more tools one has the better...
You your self said you use it once in a while...

[DrRoebuck]

To say forget you have a crop tool is silly...

Really? It's "silly" to shoot with a state-of-mind that you don't have a crop tool as a crutch to fix the shot later on? The person to whom I was referring made a comment that he was "struggling with cropping," and that seemed a little odd to me. IMO, cropping should have as little to do with the process as possible and that the effort would be better utilized during composition.

*Obviously* if you need to crop something, then crop. Like I said, I do it when necessary. But I also have a little voice asking me why I didn't see it like that when I was shooting.

[jkriminger]

...um..I think the sky is distracting and serves no visual, artistic purpose..the horse jumps better for me without it. Print it..then cut it out..whatever. Its digital...shoot the lights out..then figure out if you you really have something.

[Xia_Ke]

Beautiful horse Mcphisto I think I'm going to have to go the opposite direction on this one. While technically good, I think half of what makes this shot is the majestic background. Personally I would have liked to seen this shot pulled back a bit more to catch more of the mountains in the background. It's such a beautiful backdrop, it seems a shame to crop it out

[jgredline]

Mcphisto
One thing for sure, your photograph has done what a good pic should do...Create conversation, drama, tell a story, and controversy LoL

[Xia_Ke]

Mcphisto
One thing for sure, your photograph has done what a good pic should do...Create conversation, drama, tell a story, and controversy LoL

+1 for that comment :thumbsup: