Ownership of a photo question

[mjs1973]

Hypothetical situation:

If you sell an image or high res. file, and sign away all your rights to that image, can you still sell, or use similar photos?

For example, you set your camera up on tripod, and take two photos without changing anything. The comp, lighting, camera settings are exactly the same. The only difference in the photos is the time they were taken, which is only a split second apart. You sell all of your rights to photo A to someone to do whatever they like with it. Can you then sell photo B to someone else?

Just curious.

[drg]

There will be differences in the image, though perhaps difficult to find. They are separate images, and are covered separatly by International Copyright Law.

Why would you sign away all rights to an image? Even if you are doing "work-for-hire" or are accepting an 'embargo' there is no real reason to relenquish everything unless you are doing legal work (in which case you are an expert witness by definition.)

The only sticky part of this might be if you are selling rights to a period of work, as an example an entire sitting or shoot.

Have an entertainment attorney look over your releases and sales contracts if this involves an appropriate amount of money (an image can easily be worth $2000+ to the right buyer for say publication rights or as part of an advertising campaign.)

The other place where an issue of ownership and re-use can arise is with a readily identifialble logo that is a registered Trade or Service Mark. Then you are the Copyright holder to the photograph, but can't use it unaltered without paying a licensing fee or concealing or removing the Mark in question. But that is really another topic.

[Ronnoco]

Hypothetical situation:

If you sell an image or high res. file, and sign away all your rights to that image, can you still sell, or use similar photos?

For example, you set your camera up on tripod, and take two photos without changing anything. The comp, lighting, camera settings are exactly the same. The only difference in the photos is the time they were taken, which is only a split second apart. You sell all of your rights to photo A to someone to do whatever they like with it. Can you then sell photo B to someone else?

Just curious.

The legal answer is NO! The term used in law is that the two photos would have to be "substantially different" as in content, composition, technique, post-processing etc.
The interesting legal question is of course how different is SUBSTANTIALLY different?

Ronnoco

[SmartWombat]

>> The interesting legal question is of course how different is SUBSTANTIALLY different?

That is what prevents someone who is avoiding using your image to re-shoot a substantially similar image.

Yet when licensing (and not selling) images it's a good idea to have multiple copies.
The fee charged for losing a slide might not replace your future income form that slide.
So rather than making copies (quality suffers) I was recommended to shoot several originals.
Digitally it's different, as electronic copies suffer no degradation, and you don't send out your ownly copy of the file when licensing it.

[Ronnoco]

>> The interesting legal question is of course how different is SUBSTANTIALLY different?

That is what prevents someone who is avoiding using your image to re-shoot a substantially similar image.

Yet when licensing (and not selling) images it's a good idea to have multiple copies.
The fee charged for losing a slide might not replace your future income form that slide.
So rather than making copies (quality suffers) I was recommended to shoot several originals.
Digitally it's different, as electronic copies suffer no degradation, and you don't send out your ownly copy of the file when licensing it.

Of course, now, with a top quality slide scanner it is possible to digitize your best slides too, and keep them on a DVD.

Ronnoco

[Greg McCary]

What's the difference between licensing and copyright, and at what point do you own a photograph? Do you have to put yor name on it?

[Ronnoco]

What's the difference between licensing and copyright, and at what point do you own a photograph? Do you have to put yor name on it?

As the photographer, you are automatically the first owner of copyright of the photo. Licensing is simply "selling" the photograph, but only for a limited use such as inclusion in a book or magazine. As the photographer, you still own the rights to the photo and can re-license or "re-sell" it to another person or company for a different limited use such as inclusion in an advertisement. You do this through a written agreement when you "sell" the photo.

If you are not the photographer, then even if you "own" the physical photo, you do not have the copyright freedom to use it, unless you have a contract in writing from the photographer giving you all the rights to the photo.

Hope that is clear!

Ronnoco

[Greg McCary]

Thanks Ron, That clears it up. I'll probably never get good enough to sell pictures for a ton of money but it's nice to know the facts....
Greg