Business Question

[JBPhoto]

I've developed a relationship with a local college that wants me to shoot every sporting event I can fit into my schedule. They are promoting me to the players and parents which is a great opportunity to sell prints. I've been asked by the SID to provide CD's of games as well. I will ask more specifically what they intend to use the images for, but I've already stated that I retain the copyright to all images and that they must contact me prior to any commercial use, which is the only reason I can think of that they'd want CD's. I'd be happy allow them to use my images on their website with proper credit, but is this cool or should I be charging? If my images are used in print, what is the going rate - single or unlimited use for a flat fee? Is there a boiler plate agreement I should use? This aspect of the business is completely new to me, and it's a great opportunity so I don't want to screw it up?

Any advice is appreciated.

[drg]

Many colleges and universities once had photographer's on staff. In a budgetary move they have cut back or eliminated even full time photographer's even for press/journalism work.

I would not work for 'free'. That can bring up some legal issues as to use, even with a contract. You would be better to negotiate a fee or honorarium for a fixed period of time. That way your exclusivity can be more easily established/protected if that is important.

This kind of thing can be loads of work. More than you may want even!

You might even ask to be 'put on staff' not for a fee, but for specific benefits such as no/low tuition or use of facilities such as gyms or computer labs or trainers.

If the athletic department is a separate entity from the academic section, negotiate with them. Otherwise be certain that the administration and provost is involved to truly assure a binding agreement. Academicians have become very wise to the ways of the world and facing some of the financial pressures they do, will often get the most for the least!

Make sure that everyone knows the print rates you plan to charge in advance.

Get a credential from the school if you are shooting away from campus to prevent problems with the other institutions involved.

I'd suggest you research standard printing and publication rates. They are charts and tables and books available yearly in Publishing Catalog Yearbooks, etc. Check with a bookseller or a public library for reference information. This is important if they are planning to ramp up some athletic program or another and the image might get used elsewhere. There are waivers for legitimate journalistic use as well.

If you can't find what you are looking for as a starting point let me know and I'll dig something up on rates.

Good luck and it sound like it could be fun, but I know it can be loads of work so don't underprice your services.

[masdog]

AH! Be WARY! Be VERY WARY!

I did this once. I didn't get cash for payment, but I got college credit for it as an internship. They even paid me for some 11x14 poster sized prints that were supposed to be hung in the AD's office and initially offered to support me by allowing me to sell to the parents.

But things changed when I graduated. The AD decided he wouldn't give me an answer on anything after that, and the SID was very non-committal in his replies to my questions. After the Winter Sports Season ended, they were in a scramble to lock me up for the Spring Media guides because they needed those done in two weeks, and despite my warning that they needed to lock me in a deal, they didn't have anyone to shoot the images.

So I took about $50 less than my ideal price to just shoot the media guides. They didn't want anything else from me at that time, and although I think the SID wanted me to shoot each game, the AD wouldn't give me permission to sell to the parents. Its amazing how things turn around so quickly.

Here are a couple of pointers to help you out.

1. Get EVERYTHING in writing. You want to sell to the parents, definitely get that in writing. You want to be exclusive for the year, get it in writing. You want to handle all their media guide and website images with attribution. Get that in writing.

2. Know the NCAA regulations for the level the college is at. Division I, Division II, and Division III each have different rules regarding what photographers can and can't do. Make sure you read them over and discuss them with the school's compliance officer. Again, get everything in writing.

3. Finally...get compensation. It doesn't have to be cash, but it needs to be something. If you don't get any compensation, they will expect you to keep doing it for free. And when you do get compensation, make sure they are giving you something to make it worth your time. Getting credit counted as compensation, but it really wasn't any skin off of their back to do it, so they just expected me to keep doing what I was doing after the internship was over.

Also, be flexible with them. Some colleges have large budgets, others practically operate in the red. If they can't meet your price, try to compromise with them, but you can't be afraid to walk away if they won't negotiate.

You're right that it is a good opportunity, but colleges can be tricky clients.

[JSPhoto]

JB,

As the others mentioned, be careful, and do not work for free! Also as mentioned, know the NCAA rules.
However they didn't touch on the issue of time of use. If you go by the "standard" they would get the "rights" for two years. I say standard because thats how the AP is now, they get the right to use the photos they buy for two years now. They do pay pretty well though too. The newspapers I usually shoot for also get the rights for two years, in all cases however I still hold the copyrights. Their two year right to use as they want is pretty standard now. If tey want to use them after that two year period they have to pay again, normally less than the first go around.

As for what to charge, thats pretty much a tough call as different areas have different pay scales and each photographer has different costs. Basically you need to do some research on what others are charging for the same type of thing in your area. Seriously undercutting of the competition will cause ill-will with the competition, and in the long run will hurt you as it devalues your work as well.
For the papers I find they pay from $10 to $19 per photo they run, or some pay $10 per job (I won't touch those unless I'm already there for someone else, then it's just extra), some pay $25, some $50.
One high school track coach pays $50 plus mileage for shooting track events, some schools pay $100 - $200 per football game.

JS

[masdog]

As for what to charge, thats pretty much a tough call as different areas have different pay scales and each photographer has different costs. Basically you need to do some research on what others are charging for the same type of thing in your area. Seriously undercutting of the competition will cause ill-will with the competition, and in the long run will hurt you as it devalues your work as well.
For the papers I find they pay from $10 to $19 per photo they run, or some pay $10 per job (I won't touch those unless I'm already there for someone else, then it's just extra), some pay $25, some $50.
One high school track coach pays $50 plus mileage for shooting track events, some schools pay $100 - $200 per football game.

JS

JS,

The client that wants JB to shoot for them probably wouldn't pay much, if at all, to begin with, especially if they are a small D3 school, so you're not really undercutting anyone if you do it for non-cash compensation because they won't pay going rates.

The trick with small colleges is to find out what their budget looks like. Some really small schools have large athletic photography budgets and are willing to pay a premium to get quality images. Others are barely able to keep their athletic department out of the red, and they won't be able to pay you because they can barely pay themselves. You need to find a contact that will get you that sort of inside information.

[JSPhoto]

If a broke school district can pay going rate so can a Div 3 college! You just have to know how to deal with them.

JS

[JBPhoto]

Thanks all for your input. This school is government funded, all athletes (and students) are on a free ride and compete in D3. I am sure they have money. I spoke further with the SID at a game last week and asked what he wanted the image CD for. He wants them for their website and a brochure they produce in the spring. Said he'd like to have a few images of each athlete on hand, and specifically asked for the high res versions. I pushed back, and asked if other photographers in the past have just provided him with free CD's. He said some had. I wonder where those photographers are today - should have asked. I'm thinking I'll sell him a CD of all images for $150 and he can use them for two years, with photographer credits given when published. I think the price is low enough that it won't be an issue, yet puts some value on my work. Am I crazy?

JB

[masdog]

Double the amount.

[JBPhoto]

Sean - good suggestion. That's what I asked for and that's what they paid. I appreciate your input.