Noob needs help with picture-taking!

[Mechanicus]

Hello.

I recently purchased an Olympus SP-310, and I need help with taking pictures.
I will be mostly taking still-life pictures, such as portraits, trees, parked cars etc.
I will also hopefully be taking some pictures of a fountain, which has quite high water-jets, and moves quite fast.

I used to own an older camera (Nikon Coolpix 800), but it was not very good, and I didn't use it much at all.

A lot of the pictures I take come out blurred - this was a big annoyance with my old camera, and was what made me buy this new camera. I don't have the steadiest hands in the world, but it cannot be like this for everyone, can it? This is an example:



Here is an example of a picture I took (ignore the subjects, I just grabbed some things which were close by!). What suggestions could you offer to improve this picture?



Also, any thoughts as to what I should set my camera to when taking faster pictures, such as a fountain? I would like to get it as a still-shot, like it has been frozen

[another view]

Looks like the camera is working properly, and since the light level is low the shutter speed is long. Without a tripod and a shutter speed of about 1/30 of a second or slower, it will be blurry. The 1/30 isn't an absolute - but at that speed and faster you should be OK; the slower the speed the blurrier it will be.

You could use a flash, a higher ISO speed so that you get a faster shutter speed, or a tripod. Each one of these options has potential drawbacks depending on the result you're trying to get. Check this article on how exposure works.

[WesternGuy]

Hi Mechanicus. In my experience things are blurred for one of two reasons -- either the camera moved during the exposure, or the image was out of focus. If you could give us some insight into how these pictures were taken, then maybe that would help. What shooting mode are you using when you take the pictures?

For shooting fountains and freezing them you will need a fairly fast speed. If you want to portray the water as a fuzzy flowing item, then a slower speed will be needed. I have shot waterfalls and rivers with speeds of 1/2 to 1/4 of a second. I also found that a neutral density filter was useful. If you search net for photography, fountains and flowing water, you will probably find some more specific guidelines for this type of photography. Hopefully, someone else will be able to provide more detailed information on this forum. Good luck in your future pursuits.

Cheers,

WesternGuy

[Mechanicus]

Okay here is what my camera is set to (bear with me, I don't know what you need so it's everything I could find):

ISO - Auto
Noise Reduction - On
AF Mode - iESP
Focus - AF
Shutter Speed - 1/2
Apeture Valuse - 4.6
Exposure Compensation - 0.0

When I take a picture with the flash on, the picture comes out fine. However, it darkens the surrounding area too much, which gives is a black shadowed 'edge' to the picture. Without the flash, there is a good chance the picture will be blurred.
I am fiarly, no definately, certain that it is my movement as I press the button which causes the picture to blur. From what I gather (trying to dredge up knowlege here!) that because the flash is on, the aperture is set smaller, which also helps with blurring. IS that even close to right?

Two more examples for you, one with and one without flash. Everything else is the same.

With:




Without:

[Franglais]

Okay here is what my camera is set to (bear with me, I don't know what you need so it's everything I could find):

ISO - Auto
Noise Reduction - On
AF Mode - iESP
Focus - AF
Shutter Speed - 1/2
Apeture Valuse - 4.6
Exposure Compensation - 0.0

When I take a picture with the flash on, the picture comes out fine. However, it darkens the surrounding area too much, which gives is a black shadowed 'edge' to the picture. Without the flash, there is a good chance the picture will be blurred.
I am fiarly, no definately, certain that it is my movement as I press the button which causes the picture to blur. From what I gather (trying to dredge up knowlege here!) that because the flash is on, the aperture is set smaller, which also helps with blurring. IS that even close to right?

You are mixing up camera shake (which produces all-over blurring) and depth-of-field limitation (where part of the image is sharp - in focus - and the rest is progressively less sharp because out of focus).

What you are showing us is camera shake. When you take the image without flash the exposure is 1/2 second - far too long a period to hold the camera steady. In order to have a reasonably sharp image hand-held you need to have a shutter speed of 1/60 second at least. That means making your sensor 30x more sensitive to light. Forget it. You're already using auto-ISO. The camera is at the maximum of what it can do.

The image is sharp with flash because you are using the flash to light the scene rather than the room lighting and the flash duration is very brief (probably 1/1000 sec). No risk of camera shake, but as you have noticed, using a flash is rather like shining a torch at your subject. The light falls off very quickly behind the subject because the room lighting is just not powerful enough to be noticable.

The solution, as someone else has pointed out it a tripod. Fix your camera on a nice sturdy tripod and it won't move when you take your picture even with a slow shutter speed so the results should be sharp. And I mean a big heavy tripod, not a flimsy table-top job.

Charles

[Mechanicus]

So there is no way to eliminate that camera shake?
Whaty about if I change the ISO or the shutter speed manually?
The shutter speed goes from 15" - 1/2000, and the ISO can go from 64 - 400.

I bought the camera for casual use. Taking it on trips out to places like zoos or museums. I can't very well carry a honking great tripod around with me, setting it up every few minutes!

[pisco]

put the camera on a surface (table, books, etc) looking at what you want to photograph. Then set it on timer (self, or 10 sec) and see the results. That's what you would get if you were using a tripod.

[Frog]

Iso 400 will help with shutter speed but not enough, especially for close up subjects and freezing water motion.
You can change the shutter speed, too, but that will only help if you have a wide enough aperture and then you will lose depth of field. Now losing depth of field isn't necessarily good or bad, but a fast shutter speed with a small aperture will not be bright enough.
As was mentioned, you'll need a good tripod to overcome most of these problems.
Then with the camera ready to shoot your composed image, set it on a time delay and mirror lock if you have it, press the shutter release and remove your hand. There will me no camera motion.
It is not possible to hold a camera still enough by hand for slower shutter speeds below 1/60th though 1/30th is acceptible on rare occassions.

[Mechanicus]

If I ran the flash outside, would the resulting shutter speed be fast enough to get a good effect on the fountain? And would the flash effect a picture outside?

[Tel]

I dunno if this has already been said, but try and steady your hands. Best way for me is by moving my elbows into my sides. If you can, that is.

[another view]

The main problem above is the 1/2 second shutter speed, hand held with no flash. With the flash on, the camera will probably pick a shutter speed of about 1/60 and since the flash happens so fast there isn't much of any problem with camera shake. At 1/2 sec, there's a huge problem.

The bit of shake that happens from actually pushing the shutter release button isn't much of a factor here - that's something that people try to avoid with tripod mounted cameras, just to rule out any possible camera shake.

I didn't bring up the possibility of being out of focus because the image was equally blurry and I could see movement throughout the frame. Had the focus been off (and shutter speed been fast enough to generally rule out camera shake), different parts of the image would have a different look to them. This can be a problem though - I just don't see it here.

[WesternGuy]

If I ran the flash outside, would the resulting shutter speed be fast enough to get a good effect on the fountain? And would the flash effect a picture outside?

If you are outside on a good sunny day, you probably will not need the flash, unless you require fill-in flash effects. If you want to freeze the fountain, you will need a speed of at least 1/250th of a second. As I indicated previously, speeds below 1/2 to 1/4 of a second and even 1/8 of a second are necessary to get the flowing effect - and you will definitely need a tripod for these.

As with anything else, just experiment. Since it is digital, if you do not get the effect you were hoping for, you can simply erase it. Good luck.

I look forward to seeing some pictures of this fountain.

Cheers,

WesternGuy

[Frog]

As Tel said, holding elbows against body helps. It also helps to be breathing out slowly as you push the shutter.

[Mechanicus]

Well, thanks for the tips everyone. I'll try and get some practice in over the next few days, and then see how they come out on Sunday.

It still boggles my mind about why I need a bleedin' tripod just to take a normal picture, when I could take the same picture with ease using a film camera!

[another view]

Digital exposure is exactly the same as film - if the camera is set up at ISO400, 1/30 sec and f4 then you will have the same exposure. With digital cameras, the ISO is really set up as an equivalent. This makes the transition from film to digital easier because the rules still apply in the same way.

IOW, if you shot film with those settings you'd have the same troubles... In the case of low light you may switch to a higher speed film like ISO400 or 800, but you can also switch the digital camera to this setting.

[Mechanicus]

Aaah, I see.

My dad is quite into cameras, the older film models, and I think he knows a thing or two about ISO film etc.
He is coming with me on sunday when I go on my outing, so I'll get him to bring his camera along and try to emulate the settings on his. It might get me some good shots

[another view]

That's a great plan - spending time shooting with someone who has a lot of experience will be a big help. Copying his settings will be a good thing to try out, but also try to figure out how he comes up with those settings. It's not always a case of doing what the camera tells you... Let us know how it goes.

[freygr]

Okay here is what my camera is set to (bear with me, I don't know what you need so it's everything I could find):

ISO - Auto
Noise Reduction - On
AF Mode - iESP
Focus - AF
Shutter Speed - 1/2
Apeture Valuse - 4.6
Exposure Compensation - 0.0

When I take a picture with the flash on, the picture comes out fine. However, it darkens the surrounding area too much, which gives is a black shadowed 'edge' to the picture. Without the flash, there is a good chance the picture will be blurred.
I am fiarly, no definately, certain that it is my movement as I press the button which causes the picture to blur. From what I gather (trying to dredge up knowlege here!) that because the flash is on, the aperture is set smaller, which also helps with blurring. IS that even close to right?

The problem is that the lens on the camera can't get sufficient light to have a shutter speed fast enough to prevent camera movement when the shutter is open. I have used 1/20 or 1/15th of a second exposures before with my Leica Clone, but a 1/2 second is a long time if it's not on a tripod.

The problem you are having is very common. The light gathering power of a lens is measured by the F number ( opening of the lens is divided into the focal length of the lens example: a 50mm F1 lens is 50mm or 5cm focal length and 50mm opening for the light to pass through ). The lower F number lenses are a lot more costly to purchase than a F3.5 lens as it takes more design time and lens elements to get a good usable image, as the high F number you can use simpler lens elements.

Also with digital cameras you should not use the Auto ISO setting. For low light you should set it at the highest ISO setting possible and take a few test shoots to make sure the noise level is OK (viewed on your computer), the noise will look like snow on a TV set. If the noise is unacceptable then you back the ISO down to the next setting and repeat the test.

[Mechanicus]

Heh, I completely forgot that I started this thread!
I bought myself a book about digital cameras, and it has been helpful. I am figuring out what I need to change, and what works best where.

Here is a shot of a fountain in town. This was before I got the book, so I think I shot it on auto mode.

[Frog]

Thanks for letting us know how its going. We usually never find out.
Looks like you still have some motion in the water. That's ok...sometimes you want it to appear frozen, sometimes you want it to appear in motion.
I see you can go up to f2.8 and as fast as 1/2000th depending on light.

[WesternGuy]

Mechanicus, thanks for the picture of the fountain. Looks great. Let us know what exposure (aperture, ISO, shutter speed) you used.

This looks like one I would want to try all different combinations of aperture and shuter speed to see what effect each combination gives.

Cheers,

WesternGuy

[Mechanicus]

This is the information gleaned from the picture itself, as I cannot remember what I had set. If it was auto, I wouldn't have seen these settings anyway...