I need your help and Advice

[ComicDom1]

As some of you who have read my post know, I purchased an EOS-3 a few days ago on ebay. Of course it was represented as a new camera as a lot of things are on ebay. The guy who had it on auction, had the orginal box and books, but it was a very small picture. He also communicated well and answered all my questions.

When the camera arrived today, I started inspecting it. The screw that you put a penny in and turn to get the battery cover off was marked in the channel and had burr's on the edges like someone had it really tight and then had difficulty getting it loose. I also noticed that the PC Sync cover was missing, there was no strap, and although the English and french operating manuals looked new and were there, the registration card was also missing. Then my girlfriend noticed some imprint on the bottom. Apparently from what I could conclude, someone had put this camera on a tripod and hooked up some studio lights, or possibly a remote release cable. The guy I bought it from purchased it from another seller on ebay on May 30th who represented it as new to him. My seller bought the camera from him but decided that he was going to go digital instead so he claims he never shot the camera. He claims he only put a battery in it to power it up and make sure it powered up and the shutter works.

I really only noticed what was missing right away because last night I went to the Canon Consumer site and looked up this model and clicked on the tab of what comes in the box.

So here I was somewhat disappointed when I got the camera and it was missing parts. So I got on the phone right away and started pricing the PC sync Cap, and the Camera Strap. Its amazing that Canon has so many clueless people working for them. I had to go through 3 different depts to find my parts. None of the people I talked to were even familiar with this model and I had to keep repeating it was a film camera. Canon could not even tell me what year this body was made, even though I gave them the serial number off the body.

So after I did a little research, I shot a quick email to my seller though ebay just to protect myself and make him aware of the problem. I also sent one to the guy he purchased it from in May. My seller called me on the phone in a few hours and wants to work it out. He claims the only reason he sold it as new was because that is the way it was represented and sold to him. Of course he wants to work it out, and does not want any negative feedback or a chargeback through paypal.

So my question is, How much do you think is reasonable for me to ask to be taken off the price if the camera checks out?

The camera strap is $25.00 from Canon and the PC sync Cap is cheap but they add tax and shipping so I imagine it will easily be $50 or more just for parts.

How much so the camera be devalued because its not new? Is another $50 enough?

I paid a little more for it because I thought I might be getting new, so I paid $280.00 + 20.00 for shipping so the total was $300.

So considering its used and I need parts for it, do you think $200 is reasonable or am I way off base? The Seller paid $255 +20.00 for shipping so he had $275 in it himself, but I think the fair market price should prevail less missing parts! Of course this is only if the camera checks out and I do have permission to shoot a roll a film through it.

I also could just tell him I need to return it. He has already pulled the money out of ebay(surprise surprise) but that in itself does not make him dishonest. In fact he sounded like he was an ok guy.

So tell me what you think!

Thanks,

Jason

[mjs1973]

An interesting situation you are in. I think it's ok to ask for $50, but I would take less if he counter offered. If you can't agree on it, I would consider returning it and purchase a used camera from someplace else. Adorama, B&H and KEH.com all sell used gear and all of them have some EOS 3's to choose from.

Check them out and see what they are getting for this camera in various conditions. Perhaps you will find something from them that is a better deal that what you got right now.

[Xia_Ke]

I took a look through completed auctions and I don't think asking for $50 back is unreasonable at all given the circumstances. If the seller doesn't want to do it, I would return it and ask for a refund. There's plenty available on Ebay for less and Adorama has the EOS 3 in E condition for $264 or $334 in E+, both with box. At least you get a 90 day warranty from them. Let us know how it turns out for you.

Aaron

[photophorous]

All of this points to the camera having been used when you were told it was new. That is what would bother me the most. A battery cover like that doesn't get torn up from changing the battery once. In a studio setting a camera could be used quite a bit and still look new. I think asking for $50 is very reasonable and I might be tempted to ask for more. Test the camera first, and if you can't get the kind of refund you want, go to KEH.

Good luck.

Paul

[drg]

Jason,

If it works and it will take two or three rolls of film for one to be pretty confident of a camera that sounds to have been well used, $200 is more than enough to pay with shipping and everything.

Is the hot shoe worn, not just the paint, but the contacts? That's another wear point as well as the various labels which should be all evenly white and solid for an Excellent camera. The covers for contacts and connections being included or not is only marginally important as they are/were notorious for coming loose.

If the cover for the external motor drive is missing, or when you remove it, check that for wear and also for dirt in that area. If you see anything other than a shiny surface on the face of motor drive attachment shaft, or accumulated grime, don't even consider keeping the camera. It has been used a lot or not well kept.

The EOS-3 I purchased in the past few months I paid less that $300 including warranty and it was super clean. Most of the accessory caps missing, I knew that going in, but other wise great shape. The meter is dead on accurate, everything works well and even the lens mount looked unused.

I'd get at least as much money back as possible, or return the camera. Then I'd post feedback that it wasn't a NEW camera as advertised. Too many people trying to get something for nothing on ebay have harmed it as a good second hand market.

There are a few good reputable ebay dealers of second hand gear including shutterblade and cameta (cameta also are Authorized sellers of new cameras as well) who is also a brick and mortar store.

The KEH, B&H, and Adorama recommends are highly seconded. If you purchase a good used camera and care for it, it will last and even be something you can easily re-sell later if you desire.

Good luck and let every one know about your journey through this situation.

[ComicDom1]

Here is an update on my situation.

I wrote the seller, and also the person I discovered he purchased it from on May 30th of this year on Ebay. I asked the original seller if the camera was new, and if the strap, pc sync cover, and warranty card was there when he sold this to my seller. I also asked if the camera had ever been registered. My seller also wrote him. Of course the original guy never responded back to my seller or myself.

I also was able to call the Store the camera was originally sold from because there was a label on the bottom of the box with their toll free number. Unfortunately they said that they had no sales record of the serial number I gave them that is on the bottom of the camera. So I guess its possible that either that someone swapped boxes with another camera.

The good news is that my Seller appears to really be a decent person. Now I have no idea of what his original intentions were, but he called me on the phone, and he did want to work it out. He said he just sold it like he bought it. I pointed out to him that the camera appeared used and was missing parts. I said if he got it that way when he bought it and did not do anything to resolve it, then I should not have to pay for his mistake and I needed to either file a dispute with Paypal, return this to him, or work something out. He said he felt very bad and appoligized, and said he would like to work something out. So I did ask him if it was ok for me to put a battery in the camera and run at least a roll of film through it so I can make sure all the functions work, and then develop them so I can make sure there is no issue with the shutter. He had no problem agreeing to that. In fact I spoke to him twice that day, and once yesterday.

The hot shoe does not seem to have any marks on it at all. Normally there are some marks on the contact pins where you would slide the flash on and off. The guides for the flash have solid paint and do not appear to be worn. All the labels are clear and do not appear to be worn. The battery cover is there as well, its the screw that holds it underneath that has burr's and marks in the slot from someone who must have over tightened it and then has a coin or screw driver mark it as it slipped out of the slot trying to get it open. Underneath the cover is all shinny and clean, so no worries there. There is a slight imprint where its clear the body was mounted on a tripod but its not very noticeable unless you really look.

So in my opinion, this camera was probably used in a studio type setup and that is why the PC sync cover is missing. Honestly they are so small in size they are easy to lose. I always put mine in the pocket in my photo vest or a plastic bag that stays in my camera bag just for this purpose. All it all it looks pretty good, and it loaded the film just fine. It picked up the ISO speed. I did have to reset button to get the camera back to factory defaults so I know someone has used it.

Although I have the manual with it, I downloaded a PDF manual for Canon support prior to the camera getting here, so I am using that. I am going through each sequence just to get familiar with the camera and test each function. One of the first things I notice when shooting film for the first time in a long time last night is that I no longer can Chimp my pictures like I can on my digital cameras. So no instant feedback! I did not realize how much extra comfort and confidence that gives you when shooting.

The Seller has offered me $100 refund which will make the Camera $200.00 if you include the $200 shipping I paid. I think that is fair. He will send the money back through Paypal so at least I will know right away if I actually get it. Of course he is giving me the time to shoot a roll through the camera and check its functions before the refund will be made or our deal is final.

Thanks to those that shared advice. I will know in a day or two if the camera checks out completely good.

Jason

[mjs1973]

I know what you mean about looking at the back of the camera for that instant feedback. I find myself doing that too when I'm shooting film. Sound like you are working things out pretty good so far. Good luck.

[Xia_Ke]

...The Seller has offered me $100 refund which will make the Camera $200.00 if you include the $200 shipping I paid. I think that is fair. He will send the money back through Paypal so at least I will know right away if I actually get it. Of course he is giving me the time to shoot a roll through the camera and check its functions before the refund will be made or our deal is final...

Wow, that's a good offer from him. Luckily your seller seems to be a decent guy. Hopefully all works out well in the end. Looking forward to seeing some shots

Aaron