MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder

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  • 05-23-2005, 09:53 AM
    brian rcg
    MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    I have a few questions regarding MiniDV versus DVD camcorder. From my understanding, MiniDV uses M-JPEG format and DVD uses MPEG-2 format, which has compression, resulting in poor video quality. My first questions is: if I eventually transfer and burn the data from MiniDV tape to DVD-R disc, is the data on DVD-R MPEG-2 format anyway? If so, the final video quality is the same. The only advantage of using MiniDV as an intermediate step is for editting. Is it right?

    Second, I have a panasonic DVD recoder with HDD. When I copy movies recordered on hard disk drive to DVD-R with high quality format (XP mode), I can record about an hour. So my question is why the DVD-R used in camcorder can only record less than 30 mins of high quality video? Is the DVD-R in DVD camcorder different than the regular 4.7GB DVD-R disc? If I use DVD-R in a DVD camcorder directly, can I still edit the video before finalizing the disc? Or I have to use DVD-RAM/DVD-RW in order to edit?

    Thanks much for your help.

    Brian
  • 05-23-2005, 07:36 PM
    Skyman
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Mini DV records video in its own uncompressed format. On a computer this is an avi file not an mpeg (note that mpeg refers to motion jpeg and that mpeg 1-4 refer to different compression standards) if you save the files into a format that a dvd player will be able to play then yes you are dropping the final quality back to that of a dvd camcorder. having said this when editing a mini dv camera records the video at a higher frames per second rate than a dvd camera and so gives you finer control over editing. so the basic improvement is in control and quality the trade off is in convenience.

    A DVD camcorder doesn't actually use a dvd disc (the cameras would be to big) they use a mini dvd format that utilises a smaller disc, hence the reduction in recording time. these discs will play back in most dvd players though as unlike an LP both cd's and dvd's start playing from the inside of the disc.

    you can always edit the video although in camera editing can only be carried out whilst you are recording not after the fact (regardless of whether the camera has a -r or rw disc in it) or have another camera connected and are transfering the footage from one camera to another and editing it as you transfer. so from a practical perspective it is far simpler to transfer your video footage to your computer for editing wether using a mini dv camera or a mini dvd camera.

    In short if you plan to do ANY editing at all then a mini dv camera is going to suit your needs better, although if you don't think you will want to edit footage and simply want to watch back your home movies a mini dvd camera will save you time.
  • 05-24-2005, 08:58 AM
    brian rcg
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Thanks a lot Skyman. It helps a lot. Based on your reply, I decided to get a MiniDV camcorder.

    Brian
  • 11-20-2005, 06:51 PM
    Cynandre
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Skyman, your reply is a comfort to a man who has just bought his DVD handycam.

    I note from your reply that the final MPEG2 quality resulting from the editing of a mini DV or a DVD would be the same. However, when you read other reviews they slang the DVD so harshly that it appears a DVD handycam is a total waste.

    The movies captured in a DVD handycam is downloaded as an MPEG2 file to the computer. To the best of my knowledge, Pinnacle does not edit MPEG2 files. Do you know of softwares that can be used for editing MPEG2.

    Also, a standard disc records only 20 to 30 minutes. Are there better quality discs (like double sided) which can record for 1 to 1.5 hrs like the DV tapes.

    Chris

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Skyman
    Mini DV records video in its own uncompressed format. On a computer this is an avi file not an mpeg (note that mpeg refers to motion jpeg and that mpeg 1-4 refer to different compression standards) if you save the files into a format that a dvd player will be able to play then yes you are dropping the final quality back to that of a dvd camcorder. having said this when editing a mini dv camera records the video at a higher frames per second rate than a dvd camera and so gives you finer control over editing. so the basic improvement is in control and quality the trade off is in convenience.

    A DVD camcorder doesn't actually use a dvd disc (the cameras would be to big) they use a mini dvd format that utilises a smaller disc, hence the reduction in recording time. these discs will play back in most dvd players though as unlike an LP both cd's and dvd's start playing from the inside of the disc.

    you can always edit the video although in camera editing can only be carried out whilst you are recording not after the fact (regardless of whether the camera has a -r or rw disc in it) or have another camera connected and are transfering the footage from one camera to another and editing it as you transfer. so from a practical perspective it is far simpler to transfer your video footage to your computer for editing wether using a mini dv camera or a mini dvd camera.

    In short if you plan to do ANY editing at all then a mini dv camera is going to suit your needs better, although if you don't think you will want to edit footage and simply want to watch back your home movies a mini dvd camera will save you time.

  • 11-20-2005, 07:10 PM
    Skyman
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Cynandre
    Skyman, your reply is a comfort to a man who has just bought his DVD handycam.

    I note from your reply that the final MPEG2 quality resulting from the editing of a mini DV or a DVD would be the same. However, when you read other reviews they slang the DVD so harshly that it appears a DVD handycam is a total waste.

    The movies captured in a DVD handycam is downloaded as an MPEG2 file to the computer. To the best of my knowledge, Pinnacle does not edit MPEG2 files. Do you know of softwares that can be used for editing MPEG2.

    Also, a standard disc records only 20 to 30 minutes. Are there better quality discs (like double sided) which can record for 1 to 1.5 hrs like the DV tapes.

    Chris

    Most people who rubbish DVD do not understand that mini DV is not for everyone or are justifying a camera that doesn't really suit there needs totally. In the scheme of things the argument is a bit silly as the future for video cameras will be solid state memory cards like those used in digital still cameras. (The CEO of Sandisk the world leader in card technology - annoucned this one about 18 months ago and they already have broadcast cameras with hard drives rather than tapes, saving video as an avi file.) and many hybrid video cameras do not use tape or dvd. basically to edit video from the mpeg2 it needs to be converted to an avi file first. there are plenty of programs out there that can do this, DVD-AVi is a program i have used in the past although i don't do very much of this so there will no doubt be a myriad of posts shortly with better transfer methods. As for the longer mini dvd's i have not seen anything but this doesn't mean they don't exist.
  • 11-20-2005, 09:25 PM
    Cynandre
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Skyman, thanks for your reply. I would like to hear from others about the MPEG2 to AVI conversion software(s) available.

    I have been advised that Ulead VideoStudio Ver 9 captures video from a DVD camcorder but the website www.ulead.com does not provide details. Would welcome comments from others who may have used this software.

    Also, just found out that a 2.8 GB 80mm DVD -R disc is available for a hefty price of $60 that allows 60 min recording. Whereas a 1.4 GB DVD -R is only $10. But there are moments when you cannot stop to change disc at 1/2 hr.

    Chris
  • 11-27-2005, 01:24 PM
    shweri
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    I just had this same issue after purchasing a DVD cam. The Ulead Studio Ver. 9 can open up the VOB files that the DVD cams put out. i successfully did this. Not sure if it's translating to AVI. I only know you can capture those files, edit, and export however you like.

    Another software called "Power Director 5" can do this too, but i haven't tried it.

    My only question is -- if you translate to AVI or quicktime to edit -- are you then getting the same or similar quality as a mini-DV cam? Does this mean you are undoing the compression? Or once it's compressed to MPEG-2 have you lost that extra detail that the DV compression keeps?

    Any opinions on the hard drive cams? They compress to mpeg-2 -- so i imagine it's the same as the DVD cams. Sure would be nice if the quality was good. No chaning cartridges or discs (the half-hour mini DVD discs are a drag). I imagine you could hook to your computer to edit, then output how you like. I wish I had a better handle on how different the quality is. The JVC Everio has 1330k CCD pixels (vs. 1,000 for mini-DV cams) if I interpret correctly. Just don't know if you can uncompress in such a way that you end up with pre-compressed quality for editing.

    Thoughts?
  • 11-27-2005, 07:16 PM
    Skyman
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by shweri
    I
    My only question is -- if you translate to AVI or quicktime to edit -- are you then getting the same or similar quality as a mini-DV cam? Does this mean you are undoing the compression? Or once it's compressed to MPEG-2 have you lost that extra detail that the DV compression keeps?

    Any opinions on the hard drive cams? They compress to mpeg-2 -- so i imagine it's the same as the DVD cams. Sure would be nice if the quality was good. No chaning cartridges or discs (the half-hour mini DVD discs are a drag). I imagine you could hook to your computer to edit, then output how you like. I wish I had a better handle on how different the quality is. The JVC Everio has 1330k CCD pixels (vs. 1,000 for mini-DV cams) if I interpret correctly. Just don't know if you can uncompress in such a way that you end up with pre-compressed quality for editing.

    Thoughts?

    ok an avi file is a series of still images (for simplicities sake i am ignoring interlacing) the number depends on your local video format but in the 25-30 frames per second range so a minute of avi footage has up to 1800 discrete pictures. many of these pictures are very similar to the proceeding frame, so with mpeg compression, not every picture is saved, but only every 20th frame (for example) each suspecuent frame will now only show the amount of change from the reference frame. in this way a shot with little movement will be much smaller than a shot with a lot of movement but overall quite good compression can be achieved. in theory then converting the video back to avi involves not uncompressing the video but rendering or "drawing" the changes back into each discreet frame and saving it as an avi file. in this way, what is lost in the compression process can never be completely returned. at the moment the only good hard drive cams i am aware of are broadcast cameras that save avi files not mpeg and are desinged to be conected directly to broadcast editing systems. this save editors lots of time, logging and capturing the footage to their edit suits but subsequently does not come cheap. i am sure that in terms of the consumer market as more software packages will be able to edit directly the mpeg video but bear in mind that with an mpeg file you are mostly able to edit accurately to only 4/6 of a second whilst an avi file will give to 1/25th - 1/30th depending on your video footage. anyone who is serious about editing will know that 4/6 of a second simply doesn't give you enough control!
  • 11-28-2005, 08:57 AM
    shweri
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Thank you so much for taking the time to explain that. I've been researching all over the Web, and felt like I was getting 7/8ths of the picture (so to speak!). What I wasn't understanding or finding was what happens when you uncompress something. And so whether if the right uncompression software would make a difference and thus make the DV vs. MPEG2 quality less of an issue. But now I get it.

    I did have one other question -- when you open a MPEG2 using software that can edit it, then export again as MPEG2 -- does it compess yet again? Meaning even more frame loss? That was the other part I didn't get.

    Thanks again! :p
  • 11-29-2005, 03:44 PM
    Skyman
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by shweri
    I did have one other question -- when you open a MPEG2 using software that can edit it, then export again as MPEG2 -- does it compess yet again? Meaning even more frame loss? That was the other part I didn't get.

    In theory it is not really recompressed but rather rendered as a complete avi file then compressed. the end result is much the same, that is a general reduction in quality however you may or may not have the same source frames for compression so the areas where quality is lost may change. over time continual recompression will result in a noticable reduction of image quality but most people would not be able to pic it unless they had the original to compare to until they get to about the 4th generation (that is 4 compress/uncompress cycles). if you think you might need to do this, the way to avoid the quality loss is to save an avi file of the video and then use that to work with until you are satisfied that you are happy with the finished product.
  • 12-06-2005, 10:56 PM
    Cynandre
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Skyman, Your explanation is excellent.

    Shwerri, saw your comment about half hour disc (1.4 GB). I just spotted a one hour 2.8 GB DVD RW disc retailed at $16 per disc (Australian dollars) - good value.

    Shwerri, question for you. Ulead software did not read a DVD -R disc without finalising. What about a DVD RW disc, have you tried this format on Ulead 9.

    Chris
  • 01-18-2006, 01:57 PM
    santiago
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    I have a question.
    I want to measure specific production times at the manufacturing plant where I work, and I suggested using a video camera. I've edited with Mini DV footage at home before, so it'd be quite simple doing it with a MiniDV cam. Basically what I'd do is shoot some 5 to 20 mins of production with a tripod, then transfer to a computer with firewire, and open up the video with an editing suite, I use Premiere at home. With Premiere I can scrub through the video and find exactly what point a task begins and ends with a precision of 1/30th of a second. And voila, I can calculate my efficiencies once I have the length of time determined.

    But I've been asked if perhaps a DVD camcorder would suit the needs for this project better.

    I hesitated at the begin, but then thought about it. I've never used a DVD cam, so I really don't know what it's like editing DVD cam footage. Obviously the quality of the image doesn't matter that much, because I'll just be shooting the video, transfering to the computer, finding the production times, then deleting the video. What I mainly want are the times.
    Now, I understand that transferring video from a DVD cam takes less time, I wonder how much less. This is important, because it would be the main advantage for my purposes, since I'd be transferring alot of time each day, perhaps even 2 hours of video a day.

    I remember trying to edit MPEG video with premiere years ago, and the video would look like garbage while scrubbing through the timeline, all the similar frames would just go black. When it comes to filming production procedures, minute changes may happen, such as fastening two parts with screws or reaching for material, so perhaps if I scrubbed through MPEG or MPEG2 or MPEG4 videos, I may not be able to see everything that goes on. Where as with a MiniDV, I barely ever get dropped frames, and then everything else is totally scrubbable, I can determine exactly when something starts and ends.

    So my questions are the following:
    1. How long does it take to transfer DVD cam video to a computer? And how is this done?
    2. Can I simply pop in a DVD disc that was used for shooting with a DVD camcorder, into a computer dvd drive, and browse the video files? What format are they? VOB? Can I simply copy those files to my hard drive and open them with Premiere?
    3. What is it like editing with video shot with a DVD camera? Is it scrubbable? Will I lose frames?
    Bottom line, will I be able to determine the exact time when an event starts and ends to the accuracy of at least 1/3 of a second (1/30th would be perfect though)
  • 01-18-2006, 03:38 PM
    Skyman
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by santiago
    I have a question.
    I want to measure specific production times at the manufacturing plant where I work, and I suggested using a video camera. I've edited with Mini DV footage at home before, so it'd be quite simple doing it with a MiniDV cam. Basically what I'd do is shoot some 5 to 20 mins of production with a tripod, then transfer to a computer with firewire, and open up the video with an editing suite, I use Premiere at home. With Premiere I can scrub through the video and find exactly what point a task begins and ends with a precision of 1/30th of a second. And voila, I can calculate my efficiencies once I have the length of time determined.

    But I've been asked if perhaps a DVD camcorder would suit the needs for this project better.

    I hesitated at the begin, but then thought about it. I've never used a DVD cam, so I really don't know what it's like editing DVD cam footage. Obviously the quality of the image doesn't matter that much, because I'll just be shooting the video, transfering to the computer, finding the production times, then deleting the video. What I mainly want are the times.
    Now, I understand that transferring video from a DVD cam takes less time, I wonder how much less. This is important, because it would be the main advantage for my purposes, since I'd be transferring alot of time each day, perhaps even 2 hours of video a day.

    I remember trying to edit MPEG video with premiere years ago, and the video would look like garbage while scrubbing through the timeline, all the similar frames would just go black. When it comes to filming production procedures, minute changes may happen, such as fastening two parts with screws or reaching for material, so perhaps if I scrubbed through MPEG or MPEG2 or MPEG4 videos, I may not be able to see everything that goes on. Where as with a MiniDV, I barely ever get dropped frames, and then everything else is totally scrubbable, I can determine exactly when something starts and ends.

    So my questions are the following:
    1. How long does it take to transfer DVD cam video to a computer? And how is this done?
    2. Can I simply pop in a DVD disc that was used for shooting with a DVD camcorder, into a computer dvd drive, and browse the video files? What format are they? VOB? Can I simply copy those files to my hard drive and open them with Premiere?
    3. What is it like editing with video shot with a DVD camera? Is it scrubbable? Will I lose frames?
    Bottom line, will I be able to determine the exact time when an event starts and ends to the accuracy of at least 1/3 of a second (1/30th would be perfect though)

    if you are going to use the process you described above (utilising the timcode to determine the length of a task) then i think mini dv is the better option. a dvd camera records video as an mpeg file which would not be ideal for the task you describe. the only other thing i can suggest is setting up a clock or stopwatch somewhere in the shot so you have that timing as well. good luck.
  • 01-19-2006, 10:42 AM
    santiago
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Another question, is the video recorded with a DVD camcorder of the same quality as the video from digital cameras? I have a digital camera I just bought, it can take 640 x 480 videos, using MPEG compression I believe. It's the Sony DSC-H1. I haven't tried shooting video with it yet, but according to what you are saying, a digital camera would be just as good as a DVD camcorder. I am almost convinced that the company should purchase a MiniDV camcorder, but I am curious to know just exactly how much quality is lost witht the MPEG codec. That way, I can simply say that if they want to purchase a DVD camcorder, they may very well be better off using a digital camera, for a similar they would have 5 Mega-pixel photo shooting, plus half decent video. In that way they might think it over again and go for the MiniDV.
    On the other hand, I'm still not completely sure, since I still don't know what it's like to edit video shot with a DVD cam. Perhaps if I knew what settings the codec is set to in the DVD camera, I could take any MiniDV shot video, compress to that same setting and format, and experiment with that video, and see how it goes.

    Thanks for the quick reply Skycam, my appologies for bringing up these weird questions.
  • 01-19-2006, 05:28 PM
    MJS
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Simply put, the Mini DVD camcorder takes the same information from the chip and squashes it into a smaller space, using MPEG-2 compression. You will not have the same detail and color depth, (intensity and hue) that you will have with the same information recorded in MiniDV. I would rather have the highest quality video available to work with and then compress it to whatever playback format you need. The video quality of the best digital still camerra is still not up to MiniDV standards. It compresses the image even more than MiniDVD and also is known to drop frames. Stick with the separate cameras for now.
  • 01-19-2006, 10:29 PM
    Skyman
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    MJS, it seems that the last couple of posts to this thread haven't taken the time to read the explanations of the differences between mini dv, mini dvd and mpeg cameras. I think maybe we should work on a sticky that outlines these differences.
  • 01-20-2006, 08:00 PM
    MJS
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Great idea. PM some of your thoughts to me, I'll add mine to yours and edit and send it back, when finished, I'll sticky it as a basic terminology post, or something along that line.
  • 04-01-2007, 12:42 PM
    Gimpturd
    I need Help
    Hey I am going to buy my first video camera and i was just wondering if someone could answer some of my questions. I want to buy a video camera which i will only use for filming skateboarding. This mwans there is a lot of movement and sun and i will do a lot of editing. Could anyone reccomend or help me make my choice.

    Jonathan
  • 11-27-2007, 07:46 PM
    Skyman
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Thanks to anindyanuri for suggesting the video forum's first ever sticky! re reading the thread it does cover the differences between mini dv and dvd fairly well. I am hoping people will be able to add to this information about HD Cameras, as I have yet to make the jump so i haven't really had a chance to play with them.
  • 01-09-2008, 10:48 AM
    andy3
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    I don't have yet a harddisk camera but I think it is more recommended. Am I right?
  • 01-09-2008, 05:21 PM
    Skyman
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    I was refering to Hi Definition as opposed to Hard Disk Drive (HDD) cameras. for my money most hdd cameras record in compressed mpeg formats and are therefore still inferior to avi tape based formats. there are exceptions but they are mostly in the broadcast relm.
  • 01-10-2008, 01:50 PM
    poker
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by andy3
    I don't have yet a harddisk camera but I think it is more recommended. Am I right?

    We bought my wife's mom a Hitachi DVD-HDD camera. It's pretty easy to use. She uses it just like any other camera and when it is time to empty the camera, we move all the video to mini DVDs. The camera has more internal features that I would like to know of but I may have to. It took many disk to empty the drive. Next time, I may have to use the menu to be more selective in what to archive to DVD and may also have to use LP to get more per disk. It was cool to throw the mini DVD into our home DVD player and watch it right away. It was just like the good old days of VHS. I don't like using the video camera for playback....I think it shortens the mechanism lifespan.

    I haven't looked at over all cost. Do miniDVDs cost more than miniDV per minute?
  • 03-24-2008, 01:06 PM
    Norris99
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Hey. It's my dad's birthday soon, and we're planning to buy him a camcorder for his birthday. We have a budget of around £150-£200 (GBP), which means we can get a mid-level miniDV camcorder or a bottom-of-the-range DVD camcorder. Which would you recommend?

    We have a DVD recorder in the house, so theoretically it should be easy enough to record from the miniDV to a DVD anyway, but I think recording from a scart input is blocked as an anti-copy thing. Otherwise, I know he has a DVD burner in his computer and has burnt video to DVDs before.

    So, I guess the questions I need help with are:
    1. What's the difference in recording time between miniDV and DVD? I know DVDs are only 20-30 minutes, but what can you get on a tape?
    2. How easy is it to convert what you have on a miniDV to a format which you cam burn onto a DVD for viewing without using the camcorder or giving away or for mum to be able to watch etc?
    3. What interfaces do you need to get video from your miniDV tape onto your computer? Is there a way of extracting the AVI-ish file or do you need a TV card or will a camera with a USB-port do it? If you need some sort of analogue video interface (like using software to capture a video input as it plays), does this affect the quality of the video?

    Cheers,
    Rob x
  • 03-24-2008, 01:24 PM
    Norris99
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Also, there's one DVD/HDD combo camera that's just about within our budget, at a stretch. Is it worth it, or are we better spending the money on a straight DVD camcorder that has better reviews? What difference does having the HDD make?

    Rob x
  • 03-24-2008, 07:48 PM
    Skyman
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    as stated above if you plan on doing editing, then the mini dv gives higher quality than hdd or dvd. to answer your questions though:
    1. mini dvd is like you said up to 30 mins, mini dv is up to an hour
    2. you may need some software (such as nero or toast etc) but the process itself is as simple as copying a cd
    3. the transfer of mini dv to the computer requires a firewire port. they can be purchased very cheaply these days (less than $20) if you don't have one. the process is known as capturing and programs like windows movie maker, studio 8 or i movie make it very easy
  • 03-25-2008, 02:35 AM
    Norris99
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Thanks, that's a huge help. We're gonna go for a miniDV one, I reckon, cos he can still play it back straight away with the camera if he wants to, I've checked out PCI cards for firewire ports, and your price was right (£13 or so over here), and it gives him more scope for editing stuff.

    You also seem to get more camera for your money that way, because you're not paying for DVD stuff etc...

    Cheers! x
  • 03-25-2008, 02:51 AM
    Norris99
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Ok, one last question - how do you choose between different cameras? Given these 4, which would you pick and why? I know you can look at zoom, screen size etc, but then I don't know what I'm looking at beyond that. What justifies the price of the more expensive one (the Panasonic)?

    Panasonic NVGS90
    http://www.argos.co.uk/static/Produc...er/5632473.htm
    Canon MD101
    http://www.argos.co.uk/static/Produc...er/5632631.htm
    Sony Handycam HC51
    http://www.argos.co.uk/static/Produc...er/5632868.htm
    JVC GRD820
    http://www.argos.co.uk/static/Produc...er/5632174.htm

    Rob x
  • 03-25-2008, 03:51 PM
    Skyman
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    looks like the main difference there is that the panasonic has an optically stabilised lens, as opposed to the digital stabilisation of the others. in theory this means less "wobbly cam" especially when using the zomm, but in reality there probably isn't to much difference. non of the cameras you linked to are bad cameras, this is where physical comfort comes in, pick them all up and see which fits best in your hands and are the buttons all convenient and comfortable to access?
  • 03-26-2008, 01:18 PM
    Norris99
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Ok, cool. Thanks! You really have been an enormous help. I'll drag my mum off to the shops and we'll sort out between us which one we should get him.

    Thank you again!
    Rob x
  • 04-10-2008, 09:28 PM
    Daedalus
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Skyman, just wanted to post a big thank you for sharing all that useful information regarding the MiniDV vs DVD (buyers') dilema. I'm also looking to buy a camcorder soon before I go on my honeymoon and your explanations have made my decision a lot more comfortable. Thanks again.
  • 06-30-2008, 04:13 AM
    dfons
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    I've read this thread with much interest although my initial dilemma was whether to buy a MiniDV or a HDD camera.
    Does everything that has been said apply to miniDV vs HDD?
    Is the MiniDV quality always better than the HDD quality (due to compression issues)?
    If I buy a miniDV I would probably download/copy the movie onto my laptop via the USB cable and then play it wireless through my Xbox 360 so as it would play the movie in its original format (AVI) this seems to be a better option for me. Am I right?

    I am debating whether to get Sony DCR-HC51E or Sony DCR-S55?

    Thanks very much for your help in advance.
  • 06-30-2008, 04:22 PM
    Skyman
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Their are rare cases of HDD cameras that use no compression, however the resultant video files are very large so this is mostly for broadcast system cameras with large interchangeable hard drives. All consumer HDD cameras use some type of compression. depending on what your end use is this compression may or may not be too noticeable or objectionable as with DVD cameras I wouldn't ignore them, but people need to be aware that just because a camera is high definition doesn't mean it records in a higher quality. as mjs said "I would take a good broadcast standard definition camera over a consumer high definition camera"
  • 07-01-2008, 05:24 AM
    dfons
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    thanks for your reply Skyman.,
    Would you, or anyone, recommend the Sony DCR-HC51E as an entry level camera? and will the quality be good in a 42'' lcd tv? I've read that it wouldn't as it is not a widescreen camera.
    I am so confused, everytime I seem to decide which one to buy someone or something makes me change my opinion...

    thx
  • 07-01-2008, 08:30 PM
    byjamesderuvoDHQ
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    If you want to shoot video and then edit it to take out wasted scenes, add titles and music, etc., you're taking a hit in video quality by shooting native with a DVD camera. This is because the video on DVDs is encoded to MPEG2, a compressed format. It's great as an end of the line format, but not for shooting source footage. Likewise, hard drive based camcorders, while convenient, tend to record in MPEG2 (only JVC gives you an option to record in AVI). This gives you the same problem. Additionally, if your editor doesn't import MPEG2 footage, you will have to "re-encode" (also called demuxing) the footage into an editable format. It's a hassle for those of us who wish to edit our videos as a hobby.

    As for capture, I recommend the same firewire port and WinDV. It's free. And not only can you capture with it without dropping a frame, but thanks to the firewire interface, you can control your camcorder directly!

    That's the way I would do it. Then import it into your editor.

    JD
    http://www.digitalcamera-hq.com
  • 07-31-2008, 01:59 PM
    canyoncatz
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Hey Skyman, Read a lot of your responses . I am buying my son and daughter in law a camcorder for their soon to arrive baby . Have dealt with Adorama Camera for 20 years and am considering lower priced models, easy to handle etc:
    1. Canon DC320 DVD camcorder http://www.adorama.com/CADC320.html
    or
    2. Sony DCR-HC62 Didgetal Mini DV http://www.adorama.com/SODCRHC62.htm...hc62&item_no=1

    From what I've readhere, it seems that the Mini DV is better quality, can always transfer to dvd for storage, correct?
    Any advice? Input on the models I am considering. can go a little higher if makes sense.
    Thanks---hear you're a generally nice guy!
  • 07-31-2008, 04:49 PM
    Skyman
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Mini DV is higher quality, however Mini DVD or HDD based cameras aren't so inferior that I wouldn't use them, more that if you plan to edit what you shoot mini DV has a lot more advantages. Yes they can be converted to dvd, but the process of loading them onto a computer for burning happens in real time (so a one hour tape will take one hour to load if you want the full tape) that is where the hard drive and dvd based formats are better as transfering video is normally little more than a drag and drop. As for which model is best, unfortunately I no longer work in retail so it is hard to keep up with everything. Sticking to a reputable brand will help a lot.
  • 08-04-2008, 10:04 PM
    canyoncatz
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    appreciate your reply, info and expertise. What is the future and when will it be here. ?
  • 08-04-2008, 10:19 PM
    Skyman
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    The future is solid state memory. When large capacity solid state drives are available at an affordable price they will be a viable option for video, especially given the time benefits for editors who will no longer have to deal with tape in real time. It will be feasible to store uncompressed video on such drives and hopefully the cameras will do this, although at the consumer level at least the greed of the manufacturers will most likely prevent them using uncompressed formats ever again. If they can save a buck on the camera by compressing the video they will do it even if it leads to a degraded image.
  • 08-06-2008, 04:53 AM
    **Jenni**
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    Just been reading this thread with great interest as I have always been confused over the Mini-DV vs DVD issue! We eventually chose Mini-DV. However I now have a dilema in that we have been given a DVD camcorder so no have one of each! Initially I was thinking of selling one of them but after reading this I don't know whether or keep them both?! One for video that I will want to edit and mess about with and one for quick capture and immediate playback?! If you had both would you keep both??? Or sell one???

    They are both Panasonics - the VDR-D100 and the NV-GS60. I find them both easy to use but I don't really understand the more complicated functions anyway! :confused: :biggrin5:
  • 08-06-2008, 04:44 PM
    Skyman
    Re: MiniDV vs. DVD camcorder
    That is a lifestyle question. Personally I would stick with the mini dv and either give away or sell the DVD camera, but then I tend to only shoot video I would like to edit. for day to day use I tend to take photos. If you really thought you might need both of them (only you can answer this) then maybe lending the least used one semi permanently to someone who will be happy to return it to you when you need it. Video cameras are a little like cars in that if they aren't used they tend to break. obviously most people don't use their video every day, but once every couple of months or so for a couple of minutes is good to keep the cobwebs out. If you can't see yourself having enough to keep both cameras busy then maybe it is time to share one with someone else?