sensor sizes

[mdmc]

what are the sensor sizes of digi ps cameras in mm? I know that they are smaller than 15x 23 mm because that is the size of aps size sensors. It seems to me that an aps size sensor would fit easily into a small ps digi cam, not the smallest, but very small.
Are the manufacturers holding out to sell more slrs? As it is now digi cams are noisey above iso 100-200(fuji f10 an exeption), but increasing sensor size would solve this problem. I realize that this would affect focal length and aperture, but there are so many 35mm ps cameras that fit in the shirt pocket that its hard to believe that there are not ps digi cams with 15x 23mm sensors that work great at iso 800-3200.
Is greed holding the future back?
Mark.

[drg]

The sensor sizes vary and are based on the 'form factor' of an old analog standard. That's where the 1/1.8 2/3 4/3 and other odd number originate. It was related to numbers used to specifiy analog tubes used in the orignal television broadcast cameras. If you are really interested there are some interesting posting around the web at various 'other' photo sites.

I think the manufacturers may be trying to sell more accessories. Like extra lenses, flashes, and so forth.

There's also the price point issue. How many people will buy a <$300USD camera versus $1000USD+ camera. If its 4 or more to one, the math is simple. Build the $300 dollar variety as inexpensively as possible. For the economics to work out, most people still think about how long they expect the camera to last versus cost. Even for those once in a lifetime moments, how much is that quick snap worth? Lots of market research.

Still I've been surprised at the reported numbers of DSLR's sold. I know people who are stunned at "how good the pictures are" from even the entry level DSLR's. The camera companies waited until they truly had a stunning product to sell.

Now, I want my T4 or Epic or AF-M in digital. 6 MP in a 3000x2000 format would be perfect Sure I'd like full manual control, but with the right program settings it would not be an absolute requirement.
Problem is, for the manufactuers, if it was as good as I want, I wouldn't buy a new one for years.

That's the state of the 'arms' race right now. How to get the consumer to buy a new camera? P/S film camera wore out after some fairly well know number of rolls. Probably they figured with normal use 3-5 years for a shutterbug who had to have a camera. Built in market. May not work that way with digital. Probably the proprietary batteries will go first. That may be the 'razor blade' in this market.

Inexpensive cameras also save the retail chain. If you have to buy a better camera to get better quality, as opposed to better film which isn't needed, then you have to go back to the store.Else one only wanders into 'camera store', brick&mortar or virtual, only upon complete failure of their current camera.

Then again, the manufactuers may have underestimated what a certain number of consumers would be willing to spend to get a very high quality small, pocketable camera!!!

I'm still looking.

[mdmc]

Thanks for te reply DRG. I remember before Sigma went SLR that they were true innovators of lens shutter cameras. I think the cameras had some manual controls and accessory hotshoes. Other than Sigma was the Olympus IS series that many of the high end digi's resemble.
My favorite ps was a Samsung with a 38-105 lens that was sharp and had features a 60 sec shutter speed+ bulb, macro and super macro modes with paralax correction lines in the viewfinder, multi exposure and the focal length was displayed on the LCD. And the exposure was accurate enough to use slide film. I would buy one like this if i could use it at iso 800 and get good results without having to worry about unacceptable noise.
The F10 is tempting, but I guess i'll wait.
Enjoy the holidays,
Mark.

[Norfindel]

mmm... but how many of that small 35mm P&S have 10x Zoom? People want versatility, also, maybe that's why compacts don't have bigger sensors. That would mean bigger lenses, and more costly.

For sensor sizes, look at this links:
http://www.photo.net/equipment/digital/sensorsize/
http://clarkvision.com/imagedetail/d...l.size.matter/

[Franglais]

what are the sensor sizes of digi ps cameras in mm? I know that they are smaller than 15x 23 mm because that is the size of aps size sensors. It seems to me that an aps size sensor would fit easily into a small ps digi cam, not the smallest, but very small.
Are the manufacturers holding out to sell more slrs? As it is now digi cams are noisey above iso 100-200(fuji f10 an exeption), but increasing sensor size would solve this problem. I realize that this would affect focal length and aperture, but there are so many 35mm ps cameras that fit in the shirt pocket that its hard to believe that there are not ps digi cams with 15x 23mm sensors that work great at iso 800-3200.
Is greed holding the future back?
Mark.

The sensor on the Fuji F10 has a diagonal size of 1/1.7 inches. I've tried to work it out and I think that this comes to a sensor size of 8x12mm. This is larger than most cameras in it's class which helps to explain it's extraordinary performance (I have one).

There are several reasons for small sensors:

1. Cost. The sensor has to be a perfect piece of silicon and the difficulty in making one increases exponentially with the size of the sensor. I've heard that Canon made a loss on every one of their original 8000$ EOS1Ds (24x36mm sensor).

2. Size. The smaller the sensor the shorter the focal length required to work with it and the smaller the lens. People are asking for cameras the size of a credit card and there's no way to make that fit with a big sensor.

3. Complexity. With a smaller sensor you have more depth of field so you don't have to worry so much about focussing and the lens designer can build in a wider zoom etc. Sony just brought out a bridge camera with an APS-sized sensor and the zoom amplitude is much less than on competing cameras with small sensors.

I think that the only manufacturers selling large numbers of DSLR's (and making a profit) are Canon and Nikon. In the point and shoot market everybody is using the same Sony sensors and it's fiercely competive. The only exception is the F10.

Charles