Nikon discontinues most film cameras...

I know this would usually go in News and Rumors, but I thought this was a pretty big deal. Nikon is discontinuing all of their film cameras except the F6 and FM10. Not that I'm really surprised given the price of used film cameras like F5's for $500, etc...

I feel a great disturbance in the force.

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Originally Posted by another view

I know this would usually go in News and Rumors, but I thought this was a pretty big deal. Nikon is discontinuing all of their film cameras except the F6 and FM10. Not that I'm really surprised given the price of used film cameras like F5's for $500, etc...

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Wow...that is something. At least they came out with a new generation film camera before they pulled the plug. I tried a F6, and it's by far the best film 35mm camera around.

If this is true, then I better buy extra data storage and use up all of my film.

Loren

How about I just copy this thread to the News and Rumors forum? Oh wait - I already did ;)

For what it's worth, I checked the main Nikon site and the US site for similar press releases and didn't find anything. All the same, I wouldn't be surprised. But I doubt they'll completely discontinue film SLRs. I think they'll just become more specialized, as evidenced by the two they're choosing to keep.

I can't believe it.

<b>As a result of the new strategy Nikon will discontinue production of all lenses for large format cameras and enlarging lenses with sales of these products ceasing as soon as they run out of stock. This also applies to most of our film camera bodies, interchangeable manual focus lenses and related accessories. Although Nikon anticipates that the products will still be in retail distribution up to Summer 2006.

In recognition of Nikon’s commitment to professional photographers we will continue to manufacturer and sell the F6, our flagship film model, as well as a number of manual interchangeable lenses. Sales of the manual FM10 will also continue outside Europe.</b>

I guess my next film camera will be the F6...

This is truly an historic day. :(

And this surprises anyone how? Nikon is struggeling to stay competitive with Canon. The market has gone digital and Canon still leads Nikon by three years technology wise. The only way Nikon can hope to catch up is to drop the lower selling items and put those resources into the digital end of things.

It was bound to happen anyway, this only proves that film is dying a slow death.

JS

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Originally Posted by Photo-John

. . .
For what it's worth, I checked the main Nikon site and the US site for similar press releases and didn't find anything. . . .

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Here's the link for the US.

NIKON Reshaping Film Camera Assortment

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Originally Posted by JSPhoto

And this surprises anyone how? Nikon is struggeling to stay competitive with Canon. The market has gone digital and Canon still leads Nikon by three years technology wise. The only way Nikon can hope to catch up is to drop the lower selling items and put those resources into the digital end of things.

It was bound to happen anyway, this only proves that film is dying a slow death.

JS

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Imagine a world with no film....
I love digital, but there was a certain aura about taking your shots, sending the roll in for processing and waiting to see whether or not that special shot you got turned out. When it did, the feeling was great.

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Originally Posted by photophorous

I feel a great disturbance in the force.

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AMEN to that brother!

More like a Day Of Infamy!!!

Excuse me while I go have a good cry....

:-(

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Originally Posted by swmdrayfan

Imagine a world with no film....
I love digital, but there was a certain aura about taking your shots, sending the roll in for processing and waiting to see whether or not that special shot you got turned out. When it did, the feeling was great.

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All good things come to an end....advances in technology rule the technology hungry world, nothing any of us can do about it, but I do prefer digital over film. For one, storage is much simpler :)

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Originally Posted by JSPhoto

this only proves that film is dying a slow death.

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Personally, I don't know if I'd choose the word "slow". Five years ago, unless you were a photojournalist, most people didn't do a whole lot with digital. They were really expensive and the quality wasn't there. If you wanted prints, you didn't have all of the convenient options that you have today. There are some really great advantages to film, but it's getting harder and harder to be a film shooter.

I'm sure this is only a business decision for Nikon. They're a company that's in business to make money from selling cameras, lenses and other related stuff. If they're making a product line that doesn't make them money, then it's costing them money. A few years ago they discontinued their line of film P&S cameras. This is just a sign of the times. Some students start out on film, so that's why (I'm guessing) they're keeping the FM10. Some pros shoot 35mm film occasionally and need to have an option for a camera body, so they're keeping the F6. For the rest of us, there are great deals on used cameras like nice used F5's for ~$500 and F100's for under $400. Whether or not there will be many choices of film to put in these cameras, and labs to take this film to, is a different story.

I too feel a disturbance in the force....

Does Canon make comparable film cameras still?

There is always EBAY!

Brian

We'll start a Nikon film owners support group ...

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Originally Posted by walterick

We'll start a Nikon film owners support group ...

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There you go!
I see you already changed your signature to reflect your feelings..
Brian

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Originally Posted by mtbbrian

There you go!
I see you already changed your signature to reflect your feelings..
Brian

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What, no annoucement from Holga, too?

I read somewhere else that film camera sales represented just 3% of Nikon's sales last year, as contrasted with 19% in 2004. I don't think any company would want to offer a product line that represented that low a percentage of sales unless it was rapidly growing (not) or highly profitable (don't think so.) I think the FM10 was an acception 'cause Nikon doesn't make it and any sales just represent profit and the F6 is probably very profitable and doesn't represent any significant fixed costs.

Let's all have a mourning ritual for Nikon. Does anyone have a Canon we can burn?

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Originally Posted by walterick

Does anyone have a Canon we can burn?

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I do! (Let the flaming begin) :)

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Originally Posted by swmdrayfan

Imagine a world with no film....
I love digital, but there was a certain aura about taking your shots, sending the roll in for processing and waiting to see whether or not that special shot you got turned out. When it did, the feeling was great.

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Don't worry. I can't imagine film really going away. It will just become more specialized. I'm not sure what its place will be yet. But I am pretty sure there will be technical and artistic reasons for film to continue. The biggest problem won't be equipment, though. It will be the availability and variety of film. As the market shrinks, there won't be as much economic incentive for Kodak and Fuji to continue producing film.

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Originally Posted by another view

I do! (Let the flaming begin) :)

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Alright!
Let's Do It!
:rolleyes: :D :p ;)
Brian

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Originally Posted by Lava Lamp

What, no annoucement from Holga, too?

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LOL LL!
Brian

Aw, pj you're gonna make me cry :(

Where's my support group?

I can't really see film dying. There are a number of reasons to stick with it, mostly artistic, technical, or personal.

In 10 years, I can see 35mm entering the realm of 4x6 and other medium/large formats. It will become something used almost exclusively by artists and hobbyists. There might be some professional applications for it as well, such as weddings and some portrait work.

There will probably be a few niche films left as well. I can't see Velvia, TMax, or Porta going away anytime soon. In the end, you might have to find a specialty lab to send it out to or build your own, but its going to be around for a while.

Digital is great, and I don't think I could ever go back to film. But it still has some growing pangs to overcome. The technology is really starting to mature now, but my guess is that another 5-10 years is needed to get it caught up completely with film.

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Originally Posted by mtbbrian

Alright!
Let's Do It!
:rolleyes: :D :p ;)
Brian

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Alright Steve! Way to take one for the team!

I'm wth Brian...let's do it!

;-)

Is that while first Kodak discontinued making film camera's for the American market, and now Nikon is severly cutting back on it's film camera production, digital is still having problems. OK, let me clarify that - digital has one major problem that I see: archiving.

A couple of months ago I read Bob Krist lamenting that he wanted archival systems that were, ARCHIVAL.
.
His main lament was that he was repeatedly being let down by his archives. CD's don't hold enough data, DVD's are too slow, and he'd had two hard drives fry on him. He stated that he had an easier time producing photo's he made 30 years ago, then the ones he made three months ago.

Yes, there are RAID systems (very expensive) and there are now hard drives that are split to make backup data. I've been watching them, and while the prices are coming down, they're still a hefty chunk of change.

I lost my hard drive this past fall. I lost hundreds of digital photo's. Fortunately, I didn't lose all of them, since I had put some of them on another computer. I've since made CD's of those.

Then today, I see this article: http://msn.pcworld.com/news/article/...0.asp?GT1=7645
The gist of the article is that the CD's you bought at Wal Mart are only going to last 2 - 5 years! So much for being archival.

Part of the reason I've put off going digital is worries about losing photo's. Computers are now being made to address this (split hard drives), but the one's I've seen that look worthwhile run about $1200. Let's see, $1700 for a D200, $129 each for a couple of 1 gig CF cards, $325 for a digital compatible flash, then $1200 for a computer. So, anyone got $3500 they can spot me to get into digital? :-O

Yes, I'm playing devils advocate. I know the savings in developing will pay for the camera and related gear. But between the up front costs, and worries about the longevity of my photo's, I'm not in a big rush to jump headfirst into digital, despite Kodak and Nikon jumping on the digital bandwagon.

Besides, someone's got to keep Velvia alive! Right Rick?

:-D

That's right! I'll go digital when I have no choice left. But till then,

THERE IS NO DIGITAL EQUIVALENT OF VELVIA.

The good news for film users is, within the last 5 years or so most photo labs have upgraded their printing machines to very costly, digital print-and-scan units (such as the Fuji Frontier) that there is no need to replace for years to come. Therefore, photo labs will be able to do digital files and film for years to come, without changing their infrastructure at all.

Good news for the Velvia Bandit!

I agree Mas, Velvia, Tmax and Portra are still high volume sellers. Names like Agfa may disappear off the shelf though.

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Originally Posted by walterick

The good news for film users is, within the last 5 years or so most photo labs have upgraded their printing machines to very costly, digital print-and-scan units (such as the Fuji Frontier) that there is no need to replace for years to come. Therefore, photo labs will be able to do digital files and film for years to come, without changing their infrastructure at all.

Good news for the Velvia Bandit!

I agree Mas, Velvia, Tmax and Portra are still high volume sellers. Names like Agfa may disappear off the shelf though.

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They'll be able to print film, but will they be able to develop it? As 35mm starts to disappear, all the 1 hour photo places that are in every drug store and high-volume department store will start to disappear as well. The printing infrastructure will remain, no doubt, because many people find it easier to pay 29 cents per print rather than do it themselves.

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Originally Posted by walterick

Where's my support group?

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Right here, brother.

Do you want to borrow my hanky? A good cry will do you good. There there now. Let it out. That's good. Let the Velvia go. It's time has come.

This makes me wonder about paper and chemicals. I do my own B&W developing and printing.

I've been thinking that digital would soon replace 35mm, but it would take much longer to replace MF or LF...if it ever does. But, MF and LF still need the same paper and chemicals. I doubt they'll stop making the paper and chemicals anytime soon, but... Is that stuff going to get so expensive that only the pros can afford it, with out 35mm users buying it too? Lower volumes = higher costs. That's what I'm worried about.

Paul

The 1-hour photo places will start closing up, that's for sure.

But the pro places that already have the equipment to develop film will hang on to that equipment. I use pro shops exclusively now for my devlopment and printing. And now that I have a scanner that will scan film, I usually use their development servies exclusively. However, for a good quality print I still take in the neg or slide and let them do it.

No! Won't let go! I won't I won't I won't!

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Originally Posted by walterick

No! Won't let go! I won't I won't I won't!

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I knew I have always liked you, but you and I are very like minded!
Which is a good thing!
Film Is IT!!
Be it in my Nikon or my Holgas!
I don't plan on giving up film any time toon!
FILM RULES and Digital.... Well is just digital!
:rolleyes: :D :p ;)
Brian

Speed,

You make a good point about digital, and that is archiving the images. Right now, there is no quick and easy archival method, nor is there a perfect one. If you want a portable solution that you can easily carry around or lock in a fireproof box, DVD and magnetic tape are probably the best options. Yes, they're slow, but they also have the highest data capacity and DVDs have come down considerably in price.

Short of buying your own server, there are a few options you can do for non-removable storage. Well, you can build your own server using older hardware. Pentium IIs work great for that. Just throw in a bunch of IDE hard drives, set up a software RAID 1, and leave it in the corner. Unless you have a multiple catastrophic drive failure, you'll always be able to recover your files, even if you lose a drive. There are also some networked options that are basically self-contained RAID 5 arrays.

As digital photography advances, archival technology will advance with it until there is an effective and affordable storage technology.

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Originally Posted by masdog

They'll be able to print film, but will they be able to develop it?

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A friend who works at a custom lab told me that in the past few months their E6 (slide film) processing volume has started to go up again.

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Originally Posted by Photo-John

A friend who works at a custom lab told me that in the past few months their E6 (slide film) processing volume has started to go up again.

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The lab I use, no longer does custom color prints or Ilafchrome prints.
But they still process C-41 and E-6...
Brian

As smaller labs begin to shut down, E6 and C41 clients will get shuffled into the remaining labs who do that work, increasing their work volume and hopefully giving them economic incentive to keep those services available...

... at least until digital Velvia comes out ;)

Hey guys like you and me and Speedo are a dying breed! We film dinosaurs need to stick together!

Now where's my group hug...

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Originally Posted by walterick

... at least until digital Velvia comes out

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I think that is already here. FredMiranda.com has a Photoshop plug-in that replicates the effects of Velvia. I don't know how it works, though.