Photography As Art Forum

This forum is for artists who use a camera to express themselves. If your primary concern is meaning and symbolism in photography, then you've come to the right place. Please respect other community members and their opinions when discussing the meaning of "art" or meaning in images. If you'd like to discuss one of your photos, please upload it to the photo gallery, and include a link to that gallery page in your post. Moderators: Irakly Shanidze, Megan, Asylum Steve
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  1. #1
    Senior Member shesells's Avatar
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    Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil..

    Judge away..






    Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil
    Last edited by shesells; 10-13-2004 at 06:24 PM.

  2. #2
    Obsessive-compulsive... Steph_B's Avatar
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    Re: Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil..

    You did it: you took my breath away! and that does not happen often!

    I love it! Is this based on one of your IR pic? This is totally gorgeous, and a most appropriate posting in this forum.

    Congratulations! Now, we will all want to see more like that!

  3. #3
    Senior Member shesells's Avatar
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    Re: Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil..

    Quote Originally Posted by Steph_B
    You did it: you took my breath away! and that does not happen often!

    I love it! Is this based on one of your IR pic? This is totally gorgeous, and a most appropriate posting in this forum.

    Congratulations! Now, we will all want to see more like that!
    Steph..You have no idea what a smile you put on my face! I'll be floating on a cloud all night! It means a lot to me because I know you don't come easy
    The piece is a composite of of two IR shots, parts of another color shot and lots of PS work.
    me----->

  4. #4
    ...just believe natatbeach's Avatar
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    Re: Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil..

    sweet...I'm kinda easy...(only photographically speaking---) and this is awesome...perhaps this si your knitch? it's almost inviting but it definitely makes you reconsider...very cool
    ;)
    "I was not trying to be shocking, or to be a pioneer.
    I wasn't trying to change society, or to be ahead of my time.
    I didn't think of myself as liberated, and I don't believe that I did anything important.
    I was just myself. I didn't know any other way to be, or any other way to live."
    .
    Bettie Page

    My Temp site...

  5. #5
    Senior Member shesells's Avatar
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    Re: Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil..

    Quote Originally Posted by natatbeach
    sweet...I'm kinda easy...(only photographically speaking---) and this is awesome...perhaps this si your knitch? it's almost inviting but it definitely makes you reconsider...very cool
    ;)
    Thank you so much Nat! If wanting to do it every day all day long is a nitch (sp?) then I guess it is. I'm really glad you like it. It makes me feel warm all over.

  6. #6
    Member Jezz's Avatar
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    Re: Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil..

    this has me intrigued, how was it done? you dont have to answer, thats just what i thought when i looked at it. such a desity variation makes it look so calm and relaxing.
    Thanks...
    Sooo, do you like stuff?


    Well do ya?


    Punk?

  7. #7
    Excuse me while I burn in the sky Clicker's Avatar
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    Re: Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil..

    Quote Originally Posted by shesells
    Judge away..






    Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil
    Kit, I hereby lower my gavel to say:

    I likes it!
    Its got a very "ethereal" feel to it... I like that there are different types of trees and it makes me ask questions as well, Like what was the good? What was the evil? lol. I like the little perfectly shaped leaves at the top of the frame, not too much, just enough.
    And the Palms! With them being white like that - Reminds me of some Palm Trees that I saw once that were made of Feathers. Although ~ they were Pink Feathers, But Still, It was very neat. I also like how the ground looks as if it is water.... Leaves it up to each viewers interpretation... In Fact I did think it was water, until I saw the perfectly trimmed hedges just butting up to the shadows of the trees...

    I had to open a second window, and I'm still second guessing myself! Is that ground or water!? Its hard to tell.
    Also, Your Palms are kinda reminiscent of the lamppost in your IR thread.

    very neat, Show us more!!!

    and Do Tell!
    Rachel

    What happens when you hit a Thousand? Should I watch for Balloons?

  8. #8
    Senior Member shesells's Avatar
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    explaination.. kind of :)

    Jezz and Rachel... Gee, I'm sorry for taking so long to respond, I've been in the middle of some stuff. Thank you for viewing and critiqueing my piece. It means a lot to me that you liked it and understood it. I'll be more than glad to tell you the process and thoughts behind it.



    I took a series of IR shots in the graveyard. Of course since they were shot in the middle of the day, they won't give the kind of scary feeling of a graveyard in the middle of the night. So I thought, why don't they? What was missing was atmosphere. So I went about trying to make an erie atmosphere. While working on it, during the creative process, a lot of things changed from what I originally had it mind. Thats the part I love. It's like you're on a high and don't come down till the piece is done. You do one thing, and the way it looks make you think of something else and on and on. Like brainstorming with yourself. It rules! ok back to the piece... here's the actual process:

    I used these two IR shots and combined parts of them to make the one pic. Why? Well, the first one was taken in the graveyard but I didnt like all the hedges, I wanted it more open and something leading the eye into the picture. So I looked through my IR shots and liked the long shadow of the 2nd pic. It was taken on a different day and not in the graveyard. So as you can see they were different tones. I used channel mixer to make them the same beore combining them.




    I dragged the second photo of the long hedge and shadow onto the first image, making another layer. Then I took the background eraser and erased the parts of the top layer (shadow) that I didn't want in the pic, leaving the long shadow and parts of the hedge or whatever I thought looked good. Ok then I had the main image to work with.



    I started duplicating that layer a few times to try to make atmosphere by changing the blending modes in the layer box. Just try them all and see what they look like. The problem is, this is not going to be precise because I tried all kinds of stuff and if I had taken the time to write it down it would have interfered in the creative process. I basically don't remember every thing I did, but it doesnt matter because each time its different. Anyway, It looked kind of better but still not much atmosphere.



    So I went outside and took a pic of the clouds. I then lasso'd and copied the group of them and pasted them into a newly created channel. Desaturated them, distort them (transform) blur and stretch them etc. Make multiple layers of them and do different things to each layer like lowering the opacity on each to different levels , rotate them, flip them and move them around on the pic. When it looked pretty good, I linked and merged the cloud layers then to get rid of the white, I took a large soft brush (like size 800) and painted over the white areas I wanted to mask out. I did this because I didnt like the mistylook for this pic after all, but rather liked the look of unnatural lighting that came from bluring the clouds and masking them so the clouds themselves didnt show, but the effect from them did. Hope this makes sense. lol

    When it was the way I wanted, I used unsharp mask a tiny bit and then immediately went to edit, fade unsharp mask and changed the mode to luminosity. As far as I can remember that is it. Basically just play around with channels and masking and layers and changing modes to get the ethereal look. The end of the saga...
    Kit

  9. #9
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    Re: Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil..

    H Kit,

    Let's see if I can do this. First, and foremost, I truelly enjoy your image. As I said in another post, it's something I would like hanginig in my house.

    The thing that's nagging me about this has more to do with categorization as opposed to art. Is this "photography as art," or "illustration as art?" Of course, niether is better or worse, and it is the end result that matters. Still, you don't bring oils to a lead and charcoal drawing class.

    However, in the context of this overall thread (art as photography) are you pushing yourself ahead as an artistic photographer or illustrator (graphic artist)? Does the image capture really matter that much anymore for this image? Can you fulfill your vision with stock instead of even pushing the shutter button? Is this image using the camera or PS/effects to express yourself?

    I have these and many more related type questions. IMO, this image has become "illustration as art." Which again, there's nothing wrong with!!!

    Also, going back to our recent conversation, I stll want to iterate about plug-ins. There are several available by different manufacturers that do IR and ethereal effects. Which, if there's a market, there's a decent size niche of people doing the same things.

    Mike

  10. #10
    Member Jezz's Avatar
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    Re: Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil..

    Thanks for telling me how it was done, ive been wanting to start pic mixing, but i havent had the time.
    Sooo, do you like stuff?


    Well do ya?


    Punk?

  11. #11
    Senior Member shesells's Avatar
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    Re: Exceptional!

    Quote Originally Posted by prbowhay
    Dear Kit:

    This is amazing. I don't care how you got to the end result, it is an amazing picture and I find it to be first rate. Your work is extremely professional and impressive. I always enjoy opening your posts, I'm never disappointed.

    Thank you so much for sharing this with us.

    My Best to You,
    Penny
    Penny...Thank you so much for being so encouraging. It means a lot to me. I'm struggling to one day be you. I feel like framing your comment. lol Coming from you , it means more than you know.
    Kit

  12. #12
    Senior Member shesells's Avatar
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    Re: Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil..

    Quote Originally Posted by Jezz
    Thanks for telling me how it was done, ive been wanting to start pic mixing, but i havent had the time.
    No problem at all, except for you.. trying to decipher it. lol

  13. #13
    Senior Member shesells's Avatar
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    Re: Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil..

    Quote Originally Posted by darkman
    H Kit,

    Let's see if I can do this. First, and foremost, I truelly enjoy your image. As I said in another post, it's something I would like hanginig in my house.
    .
    I left you a little comment about this in your " Art or.." post.


    Quote Originally Posted by darkman
    The thing that's nagging me about this has more to do with categorization as opposed to art. Is this "photography as art," or "illustration as art?" Of course, niether is better or worse, and it is the end result that matters. Still, you don't bring oils to a lead and charcoal drawing class. .
    I always did! It's called mixed media.:P

    Quote Originally Posted by darkman
    However, in the context of this overall thread (art as photography) are you pushing yourself ahead as an artistic photographer or illustrator (graphic artist)? Does the image capture really matter that much anymore for this image? Can you fulfill your vision with stock instead of even pushing the shutter button? Is this image using the camera or PS/effects to express yourself? .
    Good questions Mike! For me, both of these fields go together. I love doing illustration through graphic arts and I love photography and I also do web design. lol Of course, one could use stock and there's nothing wrong with that, I've done it for illustration classes when trying to meet a deadline. But why would I cheat myself out of taking my own photos? I adore doing it. As far as your question about this image.. I used the camera, photoshop, my brain, my experiences, my emotions, my eyes, my drawing skill. Let me ask you a question. Do you use your mouth or your voice to talk?


    Quote Originally Posted by darkman
    Also, going back to our recent conversation, I stll want to iterate about plug-ins. There are several available by different manufacturers that do IR and ethereal effects. Which, if there's a market, there's a decent size niche of people doing the same things.
    Mike
    There are also lots of people taking photos, using models, etc. Actually, there is nothing anyone could do that isn't being done. Why would that stop me from doing it? The photos I used for it were shot in IR, not in color, then converted to IR in PS. That's an important distinction because I want to do every part of it myself. Why? because of the one and only reason. I like it! Why let someone else have all the fun?
    Kit :P

  14. #14
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    Re: Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil..

    Hi Kit,

    I bring this stuff up because it is a confusing topic. Reading the mission statement on this thread, or that many fine art photography magazines won't accept illustrations (I don't agree, but just pointing out). And how far can we go and still call it photography? No argument that it's art!

    A simple, off the top of my head (maybe not the best, but read between the lines), would be if you made a drawing or painting. Then take a picture of it. Is this picture now fine art? We'll define a lithograph as an original but a print as a copy. But a litho is just a contact print!

    And as I pointed out, AA reprints hardly move me at all! Until I saw a collection of his work in a gallerie, I always wanted to know what the fuss was about.

    Again, your work is beatiful and I wouldn't change a thing. Except to keep pushing you further!

    Mike

    PS: I meant I was still trying to get over to your image and make a comment!

  15. #15
    Senior Member shesells's Avatar
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    Re: Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil..

    Quote Originally Posted by darkman

    PS: I meant I was still trying to get over to your image and make a comment!
    Mike! of course I'm kidding you about that! lol you crack me up. I'll answer your other stuff later, i just this second was able to get online. They told me it would be a week before someone could come out. um no it wont! So I tried to get on with my dinosaur IMAC.. slow slow and slow, then I couldnt even see the posts on threads..ugh.. Came back upstairs to this puter and bingo its on...what a pain.
    Kit

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