Feb 17, 2009 Dooms Day for analog TV

Start saving your pennies because come Feb 17th 2009 anyone not having a digital ready TV or converter will be out of luck watching TV. It seems to me that congress got bought out by the TV makers to force TV viewers into digital TV and as usual congress bit. As of Feb. 16th all high power TV broadcasts end at midnight and all digital begins. Some stations will be switching before that date however so you may not have much time to save your pennies :( Here we have one station thats running both analog and digital 24/7 now, and they may be one of the first to go all digital next year. That bites as it's the channel I watch most, and where I am I can't get cable or satellite :mad2:
Anyway heres the link to the FCC info: http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/digitaltv.html

And the excuse they use saying this will open up frequencies for public safety is as lame as they come since 90% of all new public safety systems are trunked 700mhz and 800mhz systems and the other 10% are federal government systems in the 170mhz and 400mhz spectrums. So as usual the congressmen filled their pockets at our expense :mad:

JS

Ever since Kerry Packer showed John Howard the Cricket on a High Definition television about 5 years ago the end has been nigh for digital television. That said a digital set top box costs about $60 Australian (so about $30us) you might object to having to buy anything at all, but with 2 years to save $30 and the theoretical increase in the number of channels and the advanced content through data casting and digital television doesn't look so bad after all. I would be interested to know what the US governerment is definigning as standard definition, what is high definition and what is full definition? our broadcasters are allowed to call anything with a resolution of 720X576 or higher high definition. which basically means that for your average broadcaster instead of having to spend thousands on hi definition cameras and editing equipment, they can just buy a converter and convert the sp beta formats they are used to using after they have edited it. your tv might look sharper but the quality hasn't actually improved, oh and if you are in a lower signal area goodbye reception altogether. an analogue signal is quite watchable at about 40% strength. with digital anything below about 60% means you get no picture at all.

$30??? I'm hearing more like a minimum of $300 and thats AFTER a government $30 or $40 rebate! Here we call it supply and demand, and there will be a lot of demand with 300 million people in the country and the average home has 2 TV's which is why the feds are limiting the rebates to 2 per houshold. I have 2 TV's and soon a third for the garage :(

JS

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Originally Posted by JSPhoto

That bites as it's the channel I watch most, and where I am I can't get cable or satellite

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Cable I can understand. But you can't get satellite either? That seems very odd, what problem do you have?

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Originally Posted by mwfanelli2

Cable I can understand. But you can't get satellite either? That seems very odd, what problem do you have?

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Trees... lots and lots of trees! And in this county each tree on your property is worth $1000 to your property value.

JS

Nothing new about this - it was supposed to happen 10 years ago, then five, then two. The date has been pushed back several times because the adoption rates of new TVs and stations transmitting digital signals wasn't that great.

But by 2009, the number of people affected by this shouldn't be that great. Cable is still allowed to carry analog for a while, and satellite service like DirecTv and DishNetwork have been digital since their inception. And as of March, 2007 all new TVs made for the US market, per FCC regulations, need to be equipped with a digital tuner.

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Originally Posted by JSPhoto

Trees... lots and lots of trees! And in this county each tree on your property is worth $1000 to your property value.

JS

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I've seen satellite dishes set up in the middle of a forest. Installers will put the dish anywhere they can get a good signal, even if it means mounting it to a tree or putting a post in the ground.

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Originally Posted by masdog

Nothing new about this - it was supposed to happen 10 years ago, then five, then two. The date has been pushed back several times because the adoption rates of new TVs and stations transmitting digital signals wasn't that great.

But by 2009, the number of people affected by this shouldn't be that great. Cable is still allowed to carry analog for a while, and satellite service like DirecTv and DishNetwork have been digital since their inception. And as of March, 2007 all new TVs made for the US market, per FCC regulations, need to be equipped with a digital tuner.

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Actually the rules read: As of March 1, 2007, all television receivers shipped in interstate commerce or imported into the United States must contain a digital tuner. In addition, effective May 25, 2007, the Commission required sellers of television receiving equipment that does not include a digital tuner to disclose at the point-of-sale that such devices include only an analog tuner, and therefore will require a digital-to-analog converter box to receive over-the-air broadcast television after the transition date.

The FCC is only making the high power stations do this, all low power TV stations can continue working with analog, although few will be able to watch them unless they put dual tuners in.

JS

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Originally Posted by JSPhoto

The FCC is only making the high power stations do this, all low power TV stations can continue working with analog, although few will be able to watch them unless they put dual tuners in.

JS

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Digital TVs can still receive analog signals because they are built with dual-tuners. It just looks like crap on HDTVs.

The only people this change really affects is the poor who can't afford cable or satellite and rely on over-the-air broadcasts. But hey, they have too much already, they don't need TV too.

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Originally Posted by masdog

I've seen satellite dishes set up in the middle of a forest. Installers will put the dish anywhere they can get a good signal, even if it means mounting it to a tree or putting a post in the ground.

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Exactly. Satellite installers can get a good view of the southern sky at almost any location. We have satellite users near me whose view is obstructed by buildings to the south. The satellites are high enough in the sky to allow for a lot of creativity.

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Originally Posted by mwfanelli2

Exactly. Satellite installers can get a good view of the southern sky at almost any location. We have satellite users near me whose view is obstructed by buildings to the south. The satellites are high enough in the sky to allow for a lot of creativity.

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Any installer putting a dish in a tree should be FIRED, As a former installer, technician and supervisor at a company who did nothing but install systems I would have fired anyone doing that. Dish Network and all others who required passing a test to instal systems specifically say not to put them in trees. Mainly it's a liability issue as there is more chance of a tree getting struck by lightning and that lightning going into the home from there. I have seen the results of this from installs by other companies and our installers knew better. We'ed use large poles but thats it, never a tree. Most people wouldn't go with the poles as it was expensive, and even with my amature radio towers I still couldn't get through the trees. I have installed over 5,000 systems, and I know that a legal install will not work here. It would going in my neighbors two doors South but I am not about to do that.
It also depends on what sats your trying to hit, some are on the horizon they are so low, but none are extremely high, and the farther North you go the lower they are. And to get the most out of a moveable dish you need a clear view East to West in an arc from East Horizon to the West Horizon. With the Free To Air systems this is especially true, and it's the cheapest solution to sat systems as there is no monthly programing, just buy the gear and instal and your in business, if you pay someone you can have a system from $600 to $2000 depending on what you buy and where. Normally a 31" dish will get you all the FTA channels. Installing a moveable system is a different deal though and it's best to have someone who's done it do the install.
The drawback to FTA systems is the channels constantly appear and disapear, but there is a huge variety of channels too.

JS

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Originally Posted by JSPhoto

And in this county each tree on your property is worth $1000 to your property value...

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Wow! You should start collecting Bonsai. You could probably double the value of your home in 6 months! :D

I have Dish and agree that mounting it to a tree is not a great idea. Lightning is one point, but also the top of a tree isn't exactly stable. The dish starts to move a little bit and you'll lose your signal. And really, I could live without the whole thing... There's the web for news and Netflix for movies, etc.

Actually, $600-2000 doesn't sound bad compared to $54/month. Quick payback... But I hate reminding myself that I write a $54 check every month to watch TV!

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Originally Posted by Asylum Steve

Wow! You should start collecting Bonsai. You could probably double the value of your home in 6 months! :D

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lol, I doubt it would survive the Indiana winter though. I'd rather build a garage though and lower the property value :rolleyes:

JS

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Originally Posted by another view

I have Dish and agree that mounting it to a tree is not a great idea. Lightning is one point, but also the top of a tree isn't exactly stable. The dish starts to move a little bit and you'll lose your signal. And really, I could live without the whole thing... There's the web for news and Netflix for movies, etc.

Actually, $600-2000 doesn't sound bad compared to $54/month. Quick payback... But I hate reminding myself that I write a $54 check every month to watch TV!

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Here is a link to one Free to Air site:

http://www.sat-sales.com/fta_channels.php

Read up though, you may decide you do not want it, or you may love it. For those interested in PBS and history channels and so forth this is a way to get them without the cable bill :) There are however lots of religous channels on there. The best system is one with the larger 31" in and above dish as they pick up weaker signals. Personally I'd get it but these trees are killin me :(


JS

Analogue TV transmission will be phased out in France, zone by zone, from 31st March 2008 to 30th November 2011.

This means that the only way to receive TV over your regular antenna will be to have a TNT decoder (a small box that converts the incoming digital signal to something that a regular TV can understand.) However it also means that instead of being able to receive just 6 channels you can get 20 or more.

I don't care. There never seems to be anything to watch on TV anyway.

When the change is made here we won't get any new channels, just the same old channels that we got before over the air.

JS

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Originally Posted by JSPhoto

When the change is made here we won't get any new channels, just the same old channels that we got before over the air.

JS

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That's not quite true. When analogue is phased out, there will be "subchannels" that are contained within the digital signal. For instance, in the Chicagoland market, ABC 7 has two or three digital subchannels in addition to their regular programming and Channel 26 (WCIU) has, IIRC, 4 subchannels in addition to the programming they carry on their analog channel.

In the Green Bay, WI TV market, Channel 2 (ABC) has a single digital subchannel that carries 24 hour weather information and Wisconsin Public TV (channel 38) has 4 additional subchannels to carry a variety of programming. All these subchannels exist on the same frequency as the analog channel (IE 38-1, 38-5).

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Originally Posted by masdog

That's not quite true. When analogue is phased out, there will be "subchannels" that are contained within the digital signal. For instance, in the Chicagoland market, ABC 7 has two or three digital subchannels in addition to their regular programming and Channel 26 (WCIU) has, IIRC, 4 subchannels in addition to the programming they carry on their analog channel.

In the Green Bay, WI TV market, Channel 2 (ABC) has a single digital subchannel that carries 24 hour weather information and Wisconsin Public TV (channel 38) has 4 additional subchannels to carry a variety of programming. All these subchannels exist on the same frequency as the analog channel (IE 38-1, 38-5).

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Sean, reread... I said "WE" meaning MY area will not be getting anything different than what we get now, in fact we will actually loose channels because several have said they will no longer support over air signals once the day arrives, they will be available only via cable or sat. No real loss on those, although it means I can't watch the state football finals on the one channel, it's the only time I watch it though.

JS

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Originally Posted by JSPhoto

Here is a link to one Free to Air site:

http://www.sat-sales.com/fta_channels.php

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I looked at this site and there didn't seem to be very much at all. In fact, a few of the stations were "UPN" meaning that the list hasn't been updated in over a year.

There is a lot, I just grabbed the first one I came up with, There are all the networks, CNN, several history channels, sports and more. In fact there are, at most times 3,000 fta channels. And if you want other points of view from around the world there are hundreds of those as well. I know one guy who got a system just so he could use it to help learn a language, between taking the language at night school he listens to the channels and he's ahead of everyone in the class. He wants to get a job listening to phone and radio calls... gee I wonder who he may want to work for??????

V