Help me choose the right camera and lens

[NewguyMd]

Hi everyone new to the board here as if you couldnt tell

Anyway I am new to DSLR's and looking to get one. Million dollar question is which one. I have done research and it seems as if it is 6 of one half dozen of the other on the cameras. So then we go to the lenses and thats where I am lost.

The cameras I am looking at are the Canon xti, nikon D80, Sony A100, and since it just came out the Pentax k10d

A little bit of background most of my pictures will be of mostly ducks in flight and other wildlife but also landscapes and scenery.

Right now I am favoring the Sony and Pentax simply for the fact of the anti shake built into the camera. So I wont have to buy the pricey lenses with it in the lens correct?

Speaking of lenses most of my shots would probably be in the 400 to 600mm range so this is where I get confused. I dont want to take out a second mortgage to buy the lenses, so which camera offers the best lenses in quality, affordibility, and selection? Would it be better getting a zoom lens that goes to 400 and use an extender? or go for the lens that goes to 500 or 600?

So lets here your suggestions as far as camera and lens goes that take crisp sharp pictures at the extended range without breaking the bank.

Thanks in advance

[Canuck935]

How much are you willing to invest in a telephoto lens? I will tell you right now that anything in the range you are interested in will cost you. There are super cheap lenses out there by pheonix etc that I would suggest avoiding like the plague. I know Sony has the only 500mm AF mirror lens out there, but it makes out of focus highlights look like donuts.

You can also get third party lenses from Sigma and Tamron. The Sigma 50-500 is pretty popular.

[Frog]

Yes, you are not limited by what the camera manufacturer makes.
I have a friend with the sigma 50-500 and she loves it. I've seen well cared for, slightly used ones go for around 600 on ebay. New ones are 900+.

[danag42]

If you're shooting hand-held, I'd say the Sony (if they have the lenses you need) or the Pentax K10D. Pentax lenses of every description are available on the used market, and a new 300mm is coming out.

But such lenses are going to be pricey!

[Canuck935]

The Sony can also utilize the millions of Minolta AF lenses that are out there.

I think you'd be fine with any camera but whatever you do don't skimp on the lenses.

[NewguyMd]

Thanks for the responses so far.

To answer some questions I want to spend as little as possible just like everyone else....lol Actually I was thinking in the 1200-1500 range for camera and lens

Looking at the pentax I came up with these lenses. Havent had a chance to look at the others yet. Are these good lenses.
How would they work with an extender?


Sigma 135-400mm APO DG

Tamron Zoom Wide Angle-Telephoto AF 28-300mm f/3.5-6.3 XR Di LD Aspherical IF Macro Autofocus Lens for Pentax AF


Sigma 28-300mm f/3.5-6.3 DG Macro

[danag42]

These are high-ratio zooms. They won't be as good as low-ratio zooms or primes, but depending on what you want to do with them, they may be OK to start.

The best starter for that camera would be the DA 16-45 f/4 zoom. Remember, the format is different than 35mm. You have a 1.5 crop facor compared to a film 35mm camera. So that would be a wide to moderate telephoto zoom, of VERY high quality.

You can also find excellent lenses on the used market, no matter what camera you get. I'd go that route before buying a crappy slow zoom!

[Canuck935]

I agree with danag42. You mentioned you were concerned with the long end and a couple of those lenses you mentioned are f/6.3 on the long end which is pretty dang slow. Use that with a teleconverter and you're down another stop and that is just plain awful if you ask me. That will make it really really hard for the camera to AF and also really really hard for you to use shutter speeds fast enough to freeze any kind of action.

If you get your cam for 800 - 900 that leaves 600-700 for a lens which would be plenty for any other lens besides a long telephoto like you're looking for. You may need a little more than that for a good lens. Like danag42 mentioned though, check out the used market for any deals. Keh.com sometimes has good deals going. I don't know what's available for the Pentax but I think you could pick up a used Minolta 100-400 APO that'll fit the Sony for around the price range you have.

Also as mentioned is the 1.5 crop factor on the DSLR's that you are looking at. So a 300mm lens with the crop factor gives you the FOV of a 450mm lens.

[NewguyMd]

Now I am even more confused.

I understand what you guys are saying about the f-stop though. So what f-stop would you recomend. I have been searching through lenses and my head is starting to spin. I am having a hard time finding anything for minolta/sony, finding some for Pentax.

The reason I was leaning towards the Pentax or Sony is because of the anti shake that way I would save in the long run on lenses. Maybe this isnt right and maybe I should take a closer look at the nikon d50, d70 or canon xt. Am I really sacrificing anything or is it all in the lens?

Thanks

[Canuck935]

I would try to stay f/5.6 or lower. You are paying more money though as it goes lower though.

You won't find a lot of Minolta lenses new. Sony has announced 22 lenses so far and not all are available yet since they just entered the market a few months ago. Search the used departments and also keh.com for Minolta lenses. Also search for Sigma and Tamron lenses for Minolta/Sony mount.

Image stabilization is a plus in any form you can get it.

I think what you should do is find the camera that works best for you. I would find a store that has them on display and then go play with them (and ingnore the sales pitches). Find the one that is most ergonomic for your hands with the most intuitive controls and menu's. You'd be much happier shooting with a camera that works how you want it to rather than one that you have to fight with to get it to do what you want, reguardless of what lens you have on it.

[Ronnoco]

With the Sony A100, you have a much wider range of lenses to choose from: Minolta, Sony, Sigma, Tamron, Tokina and eventually Zeiss for really top quality, apparently a total of over 1600 different lenses. The stabilization is also supposed to be best in the Sony A100 as well.

In terms of zoom lenses, internal focus and a low number f stop make the lens much more usable under a variety of lighting conditions. You should also realize that most photos by pros are taken in the 28mm to 200mm focal range.

Ronnoco

[trog100]

i like the new penatx k10d.. i have the k100d.. its a nice camera and i assume the k10d will be better..

the image stabilization is good for say two f-stops so that negates the slow factor of the cheaper zooms..

there is a dual kit lense option with pentax.. the two lenses together willl give u 28 to 450.. 35mm equiv... with the image stabilization u get good range for very little money..

if.. and this is only an if.. u are not happy with the image quality the two kit lenses give u.. think in terms of spending another 1500 dollars to both maintain the range and improve the image quality..

and to be honest if someone says they want 400mm.. its not much help saying a lense wth a lesser range is "better".. it isnt..

i have tried the two pentax kit lense.. or the smaller kit lense and a cheap tamron 70 to 300.. i think this is what u get with the dual lense option.. they work and as i say think two f-stops bigger than the 6.3 which the image stabilization gives u and u have very expensve lense indeed at 450mm 35mm equiv..

the new pentax is the better option than the sony.. the k100d will do the job at a cheaper price.. it has the built in image stabilization..

trog

[trog100]

taken this afternoon.. late evening poor light.. dull english day.. 1/180 of a second at 200mm.. (300 35 equiv) aperture 6.3 max pentax k100d.. tamron 18 to 200 lense.. hand held..

the swans head is moving lightning fast they grab.. and i foolishly forget to turn the cameras anti shake on.. he he



not the sharpest of images but with the anti shake off and in poor light its a good one..

i do have a nice sharp pic of a swans head taken at the same time if anybody wants to see it.. the head was reasonably still with this one.. still the same poor light and anti shake off..

trog

[trog100]

another one here.. antishake off 1/125 seconds at 300mm (35 equiv) aperture 6.3.. tamron 18 x 200.. pentax k100d..



trog

ps..i never bought the two kits lense.. i bought the body and the 18 x 200 tamron all rounder.. my son has the two kit lenses tjhow.. i did pick up a cheap discontinued tokina 35 x 300 which takes me from 53 to 450mm equiv.. the tamron 70 x 300 also a makes very a good macro lense.. i dont like having to changes lenses.. he he

[TTT]

the image stabilization is good for say two f-stops so that negates the slow factor of the cheaper zooms..

Just keep in mind though.... the image stabilization is NOT a higher shutter speed. If the O.P. is trying to freeze ducks in flight, it's not going to matter that he/she has IS turned on if they have a maximum shutter speed of 1/20 second. They could bump up ISO, but it's not as good as having a faster lens

[trog100]

i have a panasonic FZ20 compact 2.8 right out to 432 mm.. a fast and sharp lense.. the drawback is its small sensor size and a max usable iso of 100..

the ability to use higher iso levels.. is the only way i can justify my dlsr.. its just a shame the cost of a 2.8 long reach dslr lense kinda brings me to back to square one.. he he..

trog

[mwfanelli]

With the Sony A100, you have a much wider range of lenses to choose from: Minolta, Sony, Sigma, Tamron, Tokina and eventually Zeiss for really top quality, apparently a total of over 1600 different lenses. The stabilization is also supposed to be best in the Sony A100 as well.

Pentax has MANY more lenses choices than Sony/Minolta. The lens mount hasn't changed since the days of the screw mount and even the super old lenses are compatible. Hands down, Pentax wins, with both old and new choices.

For newguyMD: Both are OK choices.The Sony looks nice but the A100 is a first try with nothing that makes it stand out. If this is the way you are leaning, I'd wait a couple of months for the next model to come out (hopefully for the Christmas rush).

[Canuck935]

Begun, the camera war has.