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  1. #1
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    Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    So I think cameras have finally developed enough since I got my 20D almost four years ago to make it worthwhile upgrading. I was watching some video I shot with my new video camera and noticed it's quite a bit sharper than stills with my 20D. I have been waiting for the announcement of the 5D mkII which happened today so I can compare specs against the 50D. Either camera is a significant upgrade for me and I'd get the 24-105 F4 L for either one.

    There are some strong reasons for either one. First being cost, the 50D is about $1000 less and my 24-105 would become 38-168 which would be ideal for portraits and "walk around town" shooting, most of what I do. With the 5D, I'd still have a good bit of wide angle on my walk around lens but not quite as much range since it's full frame with no
    magnification. Obviously image quality will likely be better and they have a nice big viewfinder. The 5D does lack an on camera flash which is a small issue but it is nice occasionally and I do have a 580EX for times I've been planning ahead to use flash. I'm really not sure what's going to make my decision on this. I would say examining image quality once comparisons are available but the shots posted for comparison online are generally so ideal that they will make any camera look great. One of the biggest factors for me would be high iso noise. It probably wouldn't make THIS much difference but if 3200 iso on the MKII looked like 800 iso on the 50D that alone would do it for me.

    Is anyone else here in the process of making the same decision?

    EDIT: Canon apparently has both on their site now.

    50D http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/co...elTechSpecsAct

    5D MKII http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/co...elTechSpecsAct
    Last edited by Arctirus; 09-17-2008 at 11:52 AM.

  2. #2
    Captain of the Ship Photo-John's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    If you're upgrading from a 20D, then I wouldn't worry about high ISO performance. Either camera is going to amaze you.

    In my opinion and based on what you said, wide-angle is the issue. But it's really not as much of an isse now as it used to be. There are lots of excellent super-wide lenses available for APS-C sensor cameras. Get the EOS 50D and a super-wide and you'll be set. And you'll also have a 6 FPS frame-rate.
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    I just came across this and now I'm heavily leaning toward the 5D2

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/erikfiv...7607357934354/

    Also, I don't really use wide enough to justify a spending more than just a few bucks on a lens. However the few time I would want it and not have it would annoy me. I never realized until recently that in a non FF camera the multiplier isn't a ratio of magnification but rather cropping. If I want an image zoomed in from the 105mm vs. the 168 I would get with the 50D I could achieve the same effect with no loss is quality simply by cropping an image from the 5D.

  4. #4
    Captain of the Ship Photo-John's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    I'm always playing the devil's advocate when it comes to full-frame vs APS-C cameras. So the question is, are you really going to benefit from the extra resolution and optical differences of the 5D Mark II's sensor? I think most people won't. And you could buy the EOS 50D (or even the 40D) and an excellent lens for less than the 5D would cost, body-only. For me, the 50D would be the right choice. I don't care about full frame and if I pay that much for a camera I want more speed. With the 50D I get more than enough resolution and I get speed.
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  5. #5
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    I have the best of both worlds: A 30D for speed and APS-C crop, and a 5D Mk I for full frame Landscapes mostly. I really like the large viewfinder, the lenses being what I expect (film shooter), and the IQ I get from the 5D.

    I had originally paired it with an XT, but I never liked the handling of the XT. So I bought a refurbished 30D. The 30D fills the speed need for me, the 5D is my lethargic, tripod, careful composition, body, I try to never be in a hurry with my 5D. I never feel like I need any more speed from my 5D, but then I never shoot wildlife or sports with it.
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  6. #6
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    Quote Originally Posted by Arctirus
    ...There are some strong reasons for either one. First being cost, the 50D is about $1000 less and my 24-105 would become 38-168 which would be ideal for portraits and "walk around town" shooting, most of what I do. With the 5D, I'd still have a good bit of wide angle on my walk around lens but not quite as much range since it's full frame with no magnification...
    Arctirus, I have both an APS-C body and a FF body and the 24-105 and I use them all very frequently. I can tell you that the 24-105mm lens is not a walk-about lens for an APS-C body. But it is darn near PERFECT for a FF body. I'd much rather have a wider WA than a longer telephoto for a walk-about lens.

    The 5D + 24-105mm is simply an awesome combo for street shooting and I would think the 5DmkII paired with that lens will be even better.
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  7. #7
    Powder River Imaging EOSThree's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    Quote Originally Posted by Loupey

    The 5D + 24-105mm is simply an awesome combo for street shooting and I would think the 5DmkII paired with that lens will be even better.
    I agree! I'll give you ten characters...
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    Yeah I would agree. Go for the 5dMk2. I have a 30D at the moment and am considering upgrading and for me it's the 5dmk2 all the way. The 24-105 isn't an ideal lens on an APS-C sensor and I think you hit the nail on the head when you said that it's not a magnification but rather a cropping on the APS-C. I'm thinking of going into the Canon showroom in Tokyo as I'm sure they will have a sample in there soon. Just got to find the money for one now

  9. #9
    Nature/Wildlife Forum Co-Moderator Loupey's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    Quote Originally Posted by markfielding
    Yeah I would agree. Go for the 5dMk2. I have a 30D at the moment and am considering upgrading and for me it's the 5dmk2 all the way. The 24-105 isn't an ideal lens on an APS-C sensor and I think you hit the nail on the head when you said that it's not a magnification but rather a cropping on the APS-C. I'm thinking of going into the Canon showroom in Tokyo as I'm sure they will have a sample in there soon. Just got to find the money for one now

    Hey, Mark - nice to see you're still around these parts. I don't know if you saw my previous post regarding my recent return to Japan:

    http://forums.photographyreview.com/...d=1#post297504

    Arctirus - that same thread is appropriate in this discussion as just about every image shot there and posted here were with the 5D + 24-105mm combo.
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    Definitive it will be the mark II as my choice of an upgrade, I've seen it's noise and the full weather sealing is something else. Though, the way the body sells after tax, it's not 2600 $ it's 3000 $, remember the shipping too and the sales tax. That's body alone, and that's quite a hefty price.. but It's definately worth it for me... over what I see from the 50D to date. Not saying the 50D is a bad cam, it's just the 5 D mark II is substantionally better for only 1000 $ difference (ish)
    Last edited by Kajuah; 09-19-2008 at 04:39 PM.

  11. #11
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kajuah
    Definitive it will be the mark II as my choice of an upgrade, I've seen it's noise and the full weather sealing is something else. Though, the way the body sells after tax, it's not 2600 $ it's 3000 $, remember the shipping too and the sales tax. That's body alone, and that's quite a hefty price.. but It's definately worth it for me... over what I see from the 50D to date. Not saying the 50D is a bad cam, it's just the 5 D mark II is substantionally better for only 1000 $ difference (ish)
    Remember, it's not all the camera. Put a cheap lens in front of the 5D Mark II and you've got a crappy camera. If you don't have a good lens, you'd be better off to spend your money on a 50D or even an XSi / 450D, and buy a good lens.
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    Quote Originally Posted by Photo-John
    Remember, it's not all the camera. Put a cheap lens in front of the 5D Mark II and you've got a crappy camera. If you don't have a good lens, you'd be better off to spend your money on a 50D or even an XSi / 450D, and buy a good lens.
    I also fully agree with this statement. My usual advice here is to step back and buy a lesser body and put great lenses on it. 20D, 30D, 40D, XT, Xti, Xsi, with top quality glass will capture much better photos than a 5D II with mediocre glass on it.

    In my kit, the price of the lenses($4000)far out weighs the price of the body(refurb. 30D $650, refurb. 5D $1700).
    Rule books are paper they will not cushion a sudden meeting of stone and metal. --Ernie Gann--
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    Thanks guys, I've decided on the 5D2 with the 24-105 F4L.

  14. #14
    Captain of the Ship Photo-John's Avatar
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    Deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Arctirus
    Thanks guys, I've decided on the 5D2 with the 24-105 F4L.
    Ok. As long as you're getting it with that lens. You have my permission to buy
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    Re: Deal

    Quote Originally Posted by Photo-John
    Ok. As long as you're getting it with that lens. You have my permission to buy
    Mine too . Seriously though, that lens lives on my 5D.
    Rule books are paper they will not cushion a sudden meeting of stone and metal. --Ernie Gann--
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  16. #16
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    Quote Originally Posted by Photo-John
    Remember, it's not all the camera. Put a cheap lens in front of the 5D Mark II and you've got a crappy camera. If you don't have a good lens, you'd be better off to spend your money on a 50D or even an XSi / 450D, and buy a good lens.
    True, but the camera is a great deal of it. Without it, the lens is of no value - it cannot do anything but sit, like a paperweight, on your floor. With the camera attached on the other hand..The way I do things is i buy the BEST value, best performance system for my set up and lifestyle. Then I buy the best accomodations with it. I do not take a 3000$ budget and spend it on an XT and some great glass.. instead, I buy (a 5D mark II ) and then save for some even better glass. There is no urgency to have a camera with a lens, right away, if it means saving for the very best lens to go to suit my needs - then it will be worth the wait to save for the very best glass.

    Right now a friend of mine bought the 50D with the 24-105 L f4. I intend to buy the 5D mark II, and pair it with the 17-40 f4 L, along with the 1.4 x extender. Since our close relationship, we share equipment often, so now all we need to cover the entire focal length is a nice 100-400 L and a couple primes. In the long run the quality will not diminish of the capabilities of these pieces of equipment, and we in turn will not be limited by them.

    I was taught this through a job my friend had at an airline. He was doing labor work on the floor, painting it to be specific. They had the old paint stripped off with consumer paint thinner, then the paint splattered down and spread using long rollers. There is a very lengthy (i don't know it) and proper actual way to paint a floor, especially a hangar floor made of stone. Each time they did this they spent 2000$ painting, per year. Each year they had to spend an additional 2000$ to paint the floor. It would cost them 5 000 $ to have a professional paint service come in and do the floor - and guarantee it done properly for 10 years. . but instead, they choose to paint the floor each year, every year, for 2000 $. :idea:

    That is why, I save for the best, and then buy the better I like to think of cameras as vessels. A rowboat made of wood can traverse the atlantic, we know that or we would not be here in the americas as europeans. But nowadays, you would never think of paddling the Atlantic in anything less than a powerful, preferably reinforced steel, cruise liner .. or frigate, you see my example? I do great work with a point and shoot, but there's only so far a point and shoot can go. A camera like the 50D will have limitations the 5D mark II can overcome, but the 5D mark II may be a little more than you want to pay for at the moment. In the long run, though, if you save for the best.. you will save money in the long run, and be able to advance further, with not as many limitations, as with choosing a less capable body. You see?

    Of course, quality is a price you decide on, and how much you want to spend is obviously dependent on you, too. Bracket for the best you can do to match your needs.. and there is nothing more anyone can tell you to compare the two cameras of the 50D and the Mark II.

    Myself, personally, I choose not to skimp and quality is highly important to me.. so nothing less than the updated affordable full frame will do
    Last edited by Kajuah; 09-21-2008 at 09:35 PM.

  17. #17
    Nature/Wildlife Forum Co-Moderator Loupey's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kajuah
    ...instead, I buy (a 5D mark II ) and then save for some even better glass. There is no urgency to have a camera with a lens, right away, if it means saving for the very best lens to go to suit my needs - then it will be worth the wait to save for the very best glass.
    I respect your reasoning but why buy the camera now if you're going to wait for a lens? The price for lenses won't decrease, but cameras do and upgrades are always not too far into the future.


    Also, since you are quality-oriented, I assume your 1.4TC will be Canon? And what do you plan on using it with? Won't work with the 24-105mm nor the 14-40mm.
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  18. #18
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    I also respect your reasoning...but when you can afford a lexus in 2 months, why buy a ford focus in 2 weeks? Quality, one word, quality. I've encountered people that won't do business with you unless you have the equipment to satisfy their assurances. Contary to what people say, none of those masters who worry about their not being enough light haven't had to cheap themselves on a 300 $ camera seeking commercial clients for over a year. A recent lady needs a professional photographer with professional equipment - her needs are one with professional equipment and printing devices .. a digital camera won't work. You and I know that it doesn't matter, but the client demands it, and we are at the mercy of their money.

    I don't necessarily plan to use a 1.4TC .. I don't understand where that came from.

    but

    Why won't it work with the 24-105 or the 17-40 Ls? To the best of my knowledge i think that's what you meant, i've never heard of a 14-40 mm from canon anyway. That would be way too wide, a fisheye mid-range zoom lol I thought L series lenses worked with Teleconverters from canon
    Last edited by Kajuah; 09-23-2008 at 01:16 PM.

  19. #19
    Learning more with every "click" mjs1973's Avatar
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    I think the point Loupey was trying to make was, why buy the camera now if you're not going to buy a lens until later. I could be wrong, but that is the way I understood it.

    To use your own analogy, Without it, the lens is of no value - it cannot do anything but sit, like a paperweight, on your floor. With the camera attached on the other hand.. The same it true for a camera without a lens. I can only assume that you are going to borrow a lens from your friend, until you can afford your own? If not, they you are going to have a camera in a box, sitting like a paperweight until you can afford the lens you want. If this is the case, why not wait till you have the $ for everything, then purchase it. The price may drop by then.

    The part about the 1.4x TC came from your post #16:
    I intend to buy the 5D mark II, and pair it with the 17-40 f4 L, along with the 1.4 x extender.
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  20. #20
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    This has been an interesting read. I also have a 20D and have been considering the XSI/50D/5DMKII. I think I have eliminated the MKII due to price more than anything else. I am currently going back and forth between the XSI and 50D.

    I will post again when I have finished agonizing. :mad2:
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    Well I can see your points..but let me be blunt with what I'm saying; invest in quality you get quality back, invest in crap you can expect crap back . Wait for the best and blow away the rest.

    That's my philosophy. It may not be yours and you get by fine with your ideals, but that's mine and it gets me by Not trying to cause a dispute .. we're not all in the same boat with our photography, we all have a different muse. With my muse, i require quality. With your muse, whatever suits you may be just fine. My original point is to buy what you intend to use though - like i said, you get back what you put in.. invest in crap you can expect crap back.

    For 1 000 $ more you can have a 5D mark II.. there's hundreds of advantages to this over the 50D. In my own opinion i consider the 1000 $ extra spent on improving image quality, like that of a really really nice lens. So by that theory, it essentially is the same as buying a 50D and investing 1000$ in a collection of cheap lenses.

  22. #22
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    I think you're going a bit overboard with use of the word 'crap'. I agree that the 5D Mk II would be worth the extra investment, but its not like the 50D would be a bad choice, and its not like the quality difference is enough to call the 50D/XSi "crap".

  23. #23
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    Quote Originally Posted by Anbesol
    I think you're going a bit overboard with use of the word 'crap'. I agree that the 5D Mk II would be worth the extra investment, but its not like the 50D would be a bad choice, and its not like the quality difference is enough to call the 50D/XSi "crap".
    That's your opinion..

    To your needs, they may not be. That is absolutely okay. No where am I trying to say that they are crap systems, but for me, they aren't Adequate enough to meet my needs. Replace the word "crap" with this: "Unable to measure up to"

    Better?

    The topic of the thread was what would you decide on for Articus - if it were a question of which system were better than the other, then the 5D mark II would win hands down. Who's to say he has only a 1500 $ bracket to spend on lenses? Over the years he may buy much more. And in order to fully take adv. of either or, the 5D mark II will allow him to have greater potential to develop - longer horizons and higher ceilings.

    The one thing about the 5D mark II and the 5D mark I is that through history the system line redevelops itself much longer compared to that of the 10-20-30-40-50D. In another year or two, there will be something that blows away the 50D, and in a year after that something that steps up that. The thing with investing in the full frame semi-pro eos 5D series is there may not be another upgrade for a good 3 years plus, as with the original. Even now the 5D is still a great camera, and will always be a great camera. One is limited when they only see the reflection on the other side of the mirror through a 1.6x crop, however, with 35 mm systems one will be able to take adv. of the full power of a particular lens.

    I'd just like to say I don't think any system, regardless of age or technology, is crap.

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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    I have a similar decision to make in upgrading my 20D. I would love the 5D mkII with my 24-105L lens, but I also shoot high school hockey where I need high ISO because of the dark rinks. Can I use the 5d mkII for hockey? Is it too slow? Can I use a 1.4TC and my 70-200L IS f2.8 lense to avoid the need for cropping?

    The speed of the 50D and the magnification are appealing for the sports shooting, but the image quality and higher ISO have me leaning to the 5D mkII.

    How do these two compare on autofocus? In addition to higher image quality, that is one area that I would really like to see improvement over the 20D.

  25. #25
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    Re: Canon 50D or 5D MKII?

    If you have the money then go for 5D MK2..
    Otherwise go for a old 5D. (Good value and excellent result)

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