I'm interested in purchasing either a new or used EOS 10D. However, I know it's still a good camera, but I'll end up using this frequently for street shooting over the next 5 years or so as a student.

At the rate technology is moving, would I be smarter buying a 20D for the added mexapixels and features? Will a 10D leave me in the dust a year or two down the line?

Thanks!

In my opinion, the resolution difference isn't enough to matter. And for the most part I think the 10D is a very capable camera. The 20D is much better when it comes to auto focus, battery life, and ISO performance. So, depending on your shooting style, and the amount you can get a 10D for, it may or may not be a good deal. You can certainly take good pictures with it. The 20D may be better. But whether it will make a difference to you is another question. I wouldn't try to think five years ahead with digital cameras. I've always planned for two years, and I'm still using my EOS 1D, over three years later.

Hope that helps

For your use as a student, I would recommend going the opposite direction. The 10D and 20D may have too many features. Learn the fundamentals first - sometimes this is easier done when forced to (with no options of going Full Auto). Sort of like using the legendary Pentax K1000 which only had two controls, one for shutter speed and one for aperture (ok, the manual focus was the third). Photography doesn't get any more simplistic (technically) than that. Now, the creative side to photography is completely different and you'll spend your whole life investigating that.

Although you can pick up used manual equipment (35mm) for next to nothing, I assume you want to stay digital? If so, than I would go with a used 10D, used DRebel and shoot the heck out of it. Don't worry about the features so much and leave it in Manual as much as you can so you'll know exactly what you did to get what you got.

"For your use as a student, I would recommend going the opposite direction. The 10D and 20D may have too many features."

Now this I don't agree with at all. The 10D can be used in a completely manual mode - the fact that it has more features does not require a user to use them.

Often I see forum requests, such as "what is the best beginner lens" or "what is the best beginner flash". With the technology at one's disposal today, it's foolhardy to eschew these advances for the sake of principle or traditional learning! Allow yourself to grow into a well-designed and feature-rich piece of equipment, don't limit yourself and then quickly outgrow the simpler gear so quickly. You have to give yourself SOME credit, it's not rocket science. Would one suggest that a beginning photographer not buy a modern flash, but instead to get a completely manual one and do guide number calculations? For the sake of academics, maybe, but be realistic. Modern flashes have manual settings too, and one could easily learn both techniques with a modern flash, but not a manual one. I have done this very thing, as have thousands of others.

My own advice is this: the 10D is a fine piece of gear, it is very capable of capturing demanding shots, and will be there for you regardless of how fast you are at learning to use it more effectively. Don't make the mistake of buying a piece of gear for the simple fact that it is manual, traditional or basic - it will be fine for awhile, but will quickly hinder your education regarding photography today.

It's precisely like telling someone "If you've never had coffee before, don't use sugar - you need to experience and learn to love the taste of plain coffee."

I hate black coffee, and I add sugar. But if I ever wanted it black - plain, traditional, real - it's good to know that I can just leave the sugar out.

"For your use as a student, I would recommend going the opposite direction. The 10D and 20D may have too many features."

Now this I don't agree with at all. The 10D can be used in a completely manual mode - the fact that it has more features does not require a user to use them.

The answer used to always be something like, "You should buy a Pentax K1000." But I agree. Why limit yourself? Buy the best you can reasonably afford. Use it in manual mode to learn the basic principles, and then start to play with the other features. While buying an old manual camera might build character (like walking to school in the snow with no shoes), why do it? I use my 10D in manual exposure mode 99.999% of the time. It works great.

For your use as a student, I would recommend going the opposite direction. The 10D and 20D may have too many features. Learn the fundamentals first - sometimes this is easier done when forced to (with no options of going Full Auto). Sort of like using the legendary Pentax K1000 which only had two controls, one for shutter speed and one for aperture (ok, the manual focus was the third). Photography doesn't get any more simplistic (technically) than that. Now, the creative side to photography is completely different and you'll spend your whole life investigating that.

Although you can pick up used manual equipment (35mm) for next to nothing, I assume you want to stay digital? If so, than I would go with a used 10D, used DRebel and shoot the heck out of it. Don't worry about the features so much and leave it in Manual as much as you can so you'll know exactly what you did to get what you got.

That might not be feasible. There are a whole slew of reasons why he could be looking at a 10D, and it is wrong to suggest a completely manual film camera when you have no understand of why the OP needs or wants digital.

As PJ and Miki have said, why not buy a camera and grow into it? The Canon digital SLRs are very capable on manual mode, and as the photographer grows, they can start to learn the features without having to buy a new body.

I wouldn't worry too much about the technology aspect of the digital cameras in question. In five years, your 10D will still be able to do the things that you need it to do, and it is a fine camera.

Don't allow future developments prevent you from buying the camera you want today. Get the camera that you can afford.

So we don't agree, that's OK ;) Whenever I hear the word "student" in these forums, I'm assuming that to mean student of photography and that budgets might be tight. For a beginner/student, I think that some of these cameras have just too many additional features to worry about (unless, of course, shooting in M). By the time these features are ready to be tackled, there will be better and less expensive models.

I agree completely with your coffee/sugar analogy if someone wants to just take lots of pretty pictures. But if someone says to me that they are a student of coffee, then I would imagine that that person should possess both the know-how and the skills to brew it properly and to understand what the different blends tastes like - unadulterated. To such a student you would not simply hand him a cup, send him to the percolator, and show him where the sugar and creamer is.

Unless he just wants coffee.
And I take mine with cream :)

Thanks for the replies folks.

To clarify: I'm a photo student, and have been shooting film for at least three years under an instructor. I feel I'm ready for digital, and had the opportunity to use a 10D about a year ago for about 2 weeks. I liked it at the time, and felt like it was something I could easily use.

The new 30D is looking pretty nice too ;)

Thanks for the clarification/update, drumbum. Look forward to seeing your work-in-progress!

Having "been there, done that", I agree, buy the best camera you can afford and grow into it. In the long run you will save money and be much happier. Also, do not skimp on lenses, this too is another point where if you get the basics now you can grow into different lenses, but don't buy the cheapest because it may not work the way you expect or want.
At this point, if you can swing it I'd say go with the 30D over the 10D. The 10D is simply a DRebel 300D with a metal body and a firmware upgrade.and is very outdated at this point.You could save a lot of money buying the 300D version and hacking the firmware and you have what is basically the 10D but with a plastic body, but you saved a lot of money.

JS

FYI, I saw a 10D for sale in a used camera store for $750 on Saturday. Pretty good price, but it will go lower. I still have a 10D as my main camera, having seen no need to upgrade yet. I can get 24x36 prints out of my 10D with a little work. 16x20 prints easy.

It is still a nice camera, so if you are on the cheap, it is a good buy.

You could save a lot of money buying the 300D version and hacking the firmware and you have what is basically the 10D but with a plastic body, but you saved a lot of money.
The firmware hacks for the Rebel do not (AFAIK) allow you to select the metering mode or use AF-S autofocus outside sports mode. The 10D also has a larger buffer, quick control dial and takes a battery grip.